Hybrid bow crit vs. Str bow crit

[Hasbin]

Hi i am a hybrid bow. After reading all the posts about ZOMG HYBRID BOW CRIT SUX VS PURE STR, i decided to compare my crit with some1 who posted his DMG.

NOTE:
-Im using a 60+4 bow with suky stats (see pic), he is using a 60+5 bow
-He is 2 lvls higher than me
-He has got more blues than me (look at my phy boost, only a paphetic 6%, str is expensive )
-Im still INT based
BUT:
-I got a 61 pacheon mastery (not that doesnt matter that much for a hybrid, but 55 fire going to 9 gap on 64, my imbue being behind is as much as a lack as his mastery being behind and miss 2% mag dmg too cuz the mag att book is only lv 2)

Here is my crit with strong bow vision LV 1 (also a note actually )



My naked balance to prove my str blues are bad (>more str matters alot in crits.



His crit:


http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?imag ... 518gf7.jpg

So taking all the notes and the buts in account i would say hybrid crit = str crit Why? would u ask. My opinion on that is that bow isnt a str weapon. Dont discuss other weapon crits in this thread, ill kill u .

here is my non-crit and my sexy bow (also got a 19.1k non crit but it doesnt show my bow )




And i would also like to share my opinion on hybrid bow vs str bow:
-hybrid bow lower hp (but why need the hp if ur ranged and can do fire wall) vs str bow higher hp (gives u more chance to not get killed and is in favor of 1vs 1)
-hybrid bow, consistent high dmg and also high dmg with crit against str bow, kinda low normal dmg but high dmg with crit
-its all personal preferences in bow, now bow build is bad (cept pure int maybe )
-Hybrid bow good support// str bow good support IF they crit
-350% (devil arrow or SB) doesnt have a increased chance of crit

[JackB4u3r]

Someone explained in one topic by simple mathematics the use of each weapon. The bow is a hybrid weapon!

[Tasdik]

Someone explained in one topic by simple mathematics the use of each weapon. The bow is a hybrid weapon!

+1 since there's not two kinds of bow like a glavie/spear or blade/sword it would be logical to think that it's a hybrid wepon

[Hasbin]

But im not saying pure str bow is bad. Its a cool build too. I have a lvl 40 pure str bow on tibet.
Us bowmen just have 2 questions:
-Sacrifice hp for higher non-crit dmg? (hybrids view)
or
-Sacrifice the non crit dmg for higher hp? (str view)

The crits are about the same. Thats my point.

[Jadekiss]

nice one Hasbin ^^
finally someone showed that i have right with the habrid bow... the crit doesnt sux its a bit lower but not that much
well the avarage damage is much higher so its up to everyone what you want to do with your bow char.... go pure tsr to have more hp or go hybrid to deal more damage !

cya

[Miletus]

lol ok so they do about the same dmg but can a hybird take the hits
i know a pure str can

pure str is probably not the best bow build. its probably a str heavy build
but since we have alchemy and u can get 55/55 int and str, just depends on the eq and skills. i mean if a pure str has the 55 int he would own lol

[Da_Realest]

-hybrid bow lower hp (but why need the hp if ur ranged and can do fire wall) vs str bow higher hp (gives u more chance to not get killed and is in favor of 1vs 1)

Str bow can use fire wall as well.

-hybrid bow, consistent high dmg and also high dmg with crit against str bow, kinda low normal dmg butr high dmg with crit

You sacrificed around 5k hp for that little bit of an increase in overall damage? You may have a higher constant damage but you completely neglected your hp. With a 92% mag balance you're probably better off nuking.

-its all personal preferences in bow, now bow build is bad (cept pure int maybe )

A int base bow that can't kd, knock back, hp passive, block with a shield, glaive hp passive, or stun? Doesn't sound like a good build to me.

-Hybrid bow good support// str bow good support IF they crit

STR bows are good support. You don't have to worry about having to protect them since they can tank pretty well on their own. Your bow build leans too much on int. People would pick a int spear hybrid or a s/s nuker over you any day.

-350% (devil arrow or SB) doesnt have a increased chance of crit

No need for it. If they did have critical boost, then bow would run the risk of being overpowered.

A hybrid int spear of your lvl has about the same hp as you. They do more constant damage than you, can stun, knock back, bloody fan storm, and also have the hp passive. Yet they still have trouble winning in fights.

What can you do with your lower constant damage? You have lower hp and criticals than a pure str bow. Your constant damage is not as high as a hybrid int spear, nor can you use any of the skills that they have. To other players, you're just a easy kill.

[NuclearSilo]

Im not agreed with your conclusion. Testing on 1 mob cant deduce the general case.
Why? because mangyang is an exception that no defense.
In the case physical defense involves. Your crit will be double physical damage after counting the enemy's defence. U can test that on Yetis and tell me the result.

PS: U have 13% more balance than your friend, so forget the results

[Hasbin]

Im not agreed with your conclusion. Testing on 1 mob cant deduce the general case.
Why? because mangyang is an exception that no defense.
In the case physical defense involves. Your crit will be double physical damage after counting the enemy's defence. U can test that on Yetis and tell me the result.

PS: U have 13% more balance than your friend, so forget the results

Lol any int build has an higher total dmg. Ur argument is useless.
And as for the different mobs.
Consider this in pvp:
Ill do more dmg on a pure str based char.
Pure str bow will do more dmg on a int based char.

[Hasbin]

-hybrid bow lower hp (but why need the hp if ur ranged and can do fire wall) vs str bow higher hp (gives u more chance to not get killed and is in favor of 1vs 1)

Str bow can use fire wall as well.

So what?

-hybrid bow, consistent high dmg and also high dmg with crit against str bow, kinda low normal dmg butr high dmg with crit

You sacrificed around 5k hp for that little bit of an increase in overall damage? You may have a higher constant damage but you completely neglected your hp. With a 92% mag balance you're probably better off nuking.

Look my equip is below avarge. I would have had more hp if my equip was the same as his + he is 2 lvls higher (matters like 0.5k hp).
An as for my balanced, im pumping str, my build isnt complete.

-its all personal preferences in bow, now bow build is bad (cept pure int maybe )

A int base bow that can't kd, knock back, hp passive, block with a shield, glaive hp passive, or stun? Doesn't sound like a good build to me.

Im not discussing bow vs other classes here.

-Hybrid bow good support// str bow good support IF they crit

STR bows are good support. You don't have to worry about having to protect them since they can tank pretty well on their own. Your bow build leans too much on int. People would pick a int spear hybrid or a s/s nuker over you any day.

Bow stands back. Dont need hp to tank.
And dude, iv been spear then s/s they are good. But i want bow, im happy with it.

-350% (devil arrow or SB) doesnt have a increased chance of crit

No need for it. If they did have critical boost, then bow would run the risk of being overpowered.

The point is: i wont be dissapointed to spend 3.5sec to not crit. A str Bow would.

A hybrid int spear of your lvl has about the same hp as you. They do more constant damage than you, can stun, knock back, bloody fan storm, and also have the hp passive. Yet they still have trouble winning in fights.

What can you do with your lower constant damage? You have lower hp and criticals than a pure str bow. Your constant damage is not as high as a hybrid int spear, nor can you use any of the skills that they have. To other players, you're just a easy kill.

Wth? lower constant dmg. Its higher. Grass walk is the key, and range, i dont plan to 1 vs 1.

[Hasbin]

THIS TOPIC IS NOT TO DISCUSS MY BOW BUILD.
It just to show that hrybid bow crits as hard as Str bow.

Stick to topic pls. Ty.

PS: i would own bosses haha

[darklink105]

WOOT BLOODLINE lol hasbin sux dont listen to him...lol

edit- jk jk lol he's pretty good cant wait till he's 64. but on the other hand nice crit for having a suky bow and gear. you can probably pass him and do mad damage if u just got more gold.

[Waisha]

my view:
bow isnt bad cuz of the int/str, its bad because it doesnt have the good attacks like kd/stab and knockback/stun.

[IguanaRampage]

Someone explained in one topic by simple mathematics the use of each weapon. The bow is a hybrid weapon!

+1 since there's not two kinds of bow like a glavie/spear or blade/sword it would be logical to think that it's a hybrid wepon

My god its not a hybrid weapon!!!!
You can use a hybrid with it, as I have tried out, but a str bow is an excellent bow too. If it were meant to be an only-hybrid weapon why would anti-devil (the single most vital skill for bowers imo) have a greatly increased chance of crit? Also, considering archers have distance and the strongest phys skills, it makes sense that they would want to do a lot of crit dmg and be able to tank well. It also makes sense to sacrifice a bit of hp for a bit more regular damage.
Of all people, I must say I believe Hasbin has the best idea of what a hybrid bow (int particularly) should try to do in this game as a strategy. He doesn't use this build for 1v1 much, and it would be a great build for killing uniques. What you need though, hasbin, is some great phys defense on ur protector set and some great mag reinforce on ur bow to be good at job wars and unique-killing. I really don't support 70-70 bows in 1v1 personally

[Da_Realest]

-hybrid bow lower hp (but why need the hp if ur ranged and can do fire wall) vs str bow higher hp (gives u more chance to not get killed and is in favor of 1vs 1)

Str bow can use fire wall as well.

So what?
So there is no point in you stating that as if it was a bonus. Any build can get that skill.

-hybrid bow, consistent high dmg and also high dmg with crit against str bow, kinda low normal dmg butr high dmg with crit

You sacrificed around 5k hp for that little bit of an increase in overall damage? You may have a higher constant damage but you completely neglected your hp. With a 92% mag balance you're probably better off nuking.

Look my equip is below avarge. I would have had more hp if my equip was the same as his + he is 2 lvls higher (matters like 0.5k hp).
An as for my balanced, im pumping str, my build isnt complete.
The alchemy on your gear is irrelevant since it is a variable that can be obtained by anyone. Everyone can add alchemy to their gear which puts you back at square one.

-its all personal preferences in bow, now bow build is bad (cept pure int maybe )

A int base bow that can't kd, knock back, hp passive, block with a shield, glaive hp passive, or stun? Doesn't sound like a good build to me.

Im not discussing bow vs other classes here.
Seems you misunderstood. I wasn't talking about bow builds in general vs other builds but implying that you lack what str heavy bow builds have. HP. Thats the only defense bow builds have and you took away most of it

-Hybrid bow good support// str bow good support IF they crit

STR bows are good support. You don't have to worry about having to protect them since they can tank pretty well on their own. Your bow build leans too much on int. People would pick a int spear hybrid or a s/s nuker over you any day.

Yes you do. In job wars and guild wars people come after the spear nukers and archers first. Usually the spear nukers switch to s/s before war, making you the primary target for an easy kill.

Bow stands back. Dont need hp to tank.
And dude, iv been spear then s/s they are good. But i want bow, im happy with it.
Yes you do. In job wars and guild wars people come after the spear nukers and archers first. Usually the spear nukers switch to s/s before war, making you the primary target for an easy kill.

-350% (devil arrow or SB) doesnt have a increased chance of crit

No need for it. If they did have critical boost, then bow would run the risk of being overpowered.

The point is: i wont be dissapointed to spend 3.5sec to not crit. A str Bow would.
Nope. I know I can last long enough until I get another critical so its really no problem.

A hybrid int spear of your lvl has about the same hp as you. They do more constant damage than you, can stun, knock back, bloody fan storm, and also have the hp passive. Yet they still have trouble winning in fights.

What can you do with your lower constant damage? You have lower hp and criticals than a pure str bow. Your constant damage is not as high as a hybrid int spear, nor can you use any of the skills that they have. To other players, you're just a easy kill.

Wth? lower constant dmg. Its higher. Grass walk is the key, and range, i dont plan to 1 vs 1.

You missed my point. A str bow can tank until they kill. You can't do anything. If a spear hybrid's high constant damage and status effects(stun, knock back, etc.) and buffs(bloody fan storm, hp passive) have a hard time killing then what will you do with a lower constant damage than them, no status effects, and no buffs.

Grass walk is not the key. Everyone gets it. You grass walk and run, they do the same. You ghost walk away, they can do the same. Doesn't matter if you don't 1v1. Like I said earlier, in job wars and guild wars, spear nukers and bow builds are the first targets. Spear nukers have low hp which makes them easy to kill. Bow builds have no form of defence which makes them easy to kill. Even so, you're a hybrid bow so you have even less hp which makes you even easier to kill.

And no, bow isn't much of a hybrid weapon. Its more for pure str and str heavy hybrid bows. If it was a hybrid weapon, then there would be magic attacks under the Pacheon tree. Bow is a str based weapon which is why each new book of anti devil increases your chances of getting a critical.

[NuclearSilo]

Someone explained in one topic by simple mathematics the use of each weapon. The bow is a hybrid weapon!

There is no definition of a hybrid or str or int weapon.
I even saw a player use sword (npc) and deal more damage on mob than using blade (he is a pure str). Explain this!!!

@Hasbin: I told u to test the crit on Yeti. So dont bring your conclusion too soon about my argument is useless. Show me the proof. I dont care who does most dmg on phy/mag based attack. But show me the CRIT

[Hasbin]

If it were meant to be an only-hybrid weapon why would anti-devil (the single most vital skill for bowers imo) have a greatly increased chance of crit?

Bow is a str based weapon which is why each new book of anti devil increases your chances of getting a critical.

Why do u ppl keep talking about critical increase. I benefit of it as much as a pure str does. LOOK ABOVE, JUST PROVEN THAT PURE STR CRIT=HYBRID CRIT.

And @Da_realest bow isnt made for tanking either, it doesnt have the skills for it. Whats the use of the range when u say pure str is good tank?
And what to do against shield users who have crit reduce? Are u gonna be happy with inflicting low dmg on them?

Bow is ment for conflicting high dmg. We can endlessly argue about that, but that isnt my point. My point is the crit comparison.

PS: A hybrid str bow will do the same crit dmg as pure str too according to me.

[IguanaRampage]

Did you read the rest of what I said? Sheesh you hybrid bows seem to think yours is the best build ever when all I said was it was a good build, but that bow is not a hybrids-only weapon and that pure str bow is incredibly deadly!!

[Hasbin]

Did you read the rest of what I said? Sheesh you hybrid bows seem to think yours is the best build ever when all I said was it was a good build, but that bow is not a hybrids-only weapon and that pure str bow is incredibly deadly!!

But im not saying pure str bow is bad. Its a cool build too. I have a lvl 40 pure str bow on tibet.
Us bowmen just have 2 questions:
-Sacrifice hp for higher non-crit dmg? (hybrids view)
or
-Sacrifice the non crit dmg for higher hp? (str view)

The crits are about the same. Thats my point.

Have i ever said pure str bow is bad? As a matter of fact i said its a good build too. I think bow is a all-go weapon, and its a personal flavour.
As long as ur happy playing ur char.

PS: after reading ur whole post again, i must say i respect u, unlike most stereotyped persons that post here

[Da_Realest]

Why do u ppl keep talking about critical increase. I benefit of it as much as a pure str does. LOOK ABOVE, JUST PROVEN THAT PURE STR CRIT=HYBRID CRIT.

You're just being one sided. Look at the big picture. I said it before. You sacrificed too much hp to benefit.

And @Da_realest bow isnt made for tanking either, it doesnt have the skills for it. Whats the use of the range when u say pure str is good tank?

Thats why you need to stay str heavy. You don't have the skills to by you time for extra damage. Your hp is your only defense. Your range is neutralize when all it takes is a simple click or key press to ghost walk to you.

And what to do against shield users who have crit reduce? Are u gonna be happy with inflicting low dmg on them?

No one holding a shield with a +3 weapon can kill me. Besides, strongbow is like a critical on anti devil bow.

Bow is ment for conflicting high dmg. We can endlessly argue about that, but that isnt my point. My point is the crit comparison.

You can't inflict that high damage if you're laying on the ground dead.

PS: A hybrid str bow will do the same crit dmg as pure str too according to me.

Too bad thats only according to you.

[Hasbin]

Why do u ppl keep talking about critical increase. I benefit of it as much as a pure str does. LOOK ABOVE, JUST PROVEN THAT PURE STR CRIT=HYBRID CRIT.

You're just being one sided. Look at the big picture. I said it before. You sacrificed too much hp to benefit.

And @Da_realest bow isnt made for tanking either, it doesnt have the skills for it. Whats the use of the range when u say pure str is good tank?

Thats why you need to stay str heavy. You don't have the skills to by you time for extra damage. Your hp is your only defense. Your range is neutralize when all it takes is a simple click or key press to ghost walk to you.

And what to do against shield users who have crit reduce? Are u gonna be happy with inflicting low dmg on them?

No one holding a shield with a +3 weapon can kill me. Besides, strongbow is like a critical on anti devil bow.

Bow is ment for conflicting high dmg. We can endlessly argue about that, but that isnt my point. My point is the crit comparison.

You can't inflict that high damage if you're laying on the ground dead.

PS: A hybrid str bow will do the same crit dmg as pure str too according to me.

Too bad thats only according to you.

Not discussing with u anymore, u keep saying the same things lol.
And yes i sacrified hp, but still got (will have, see my sig:going 70:70) enough hp to survive 1 or 2 nukes if im in garments, and survive a crit or 2 of a glavier. After that ill start running, no need to stand and tank. Use the almighty grass walk to give me sec more to pot and go ranged again.
And i know u are gonna say, the opponent will use grass walk too, but he cant predict where im going. So ill have a 1 sec head start.
Remember the song: If at first u dont succeed, dust urself off and try again.
And i u are so in with tanking, blader would fit u very good.

And for the 3rd time im not planning on going 1vs1 too much.

And look at liquidsmooth for the str hybrid crit, thats ur proof.

Now stop saying all the things u said once again, i understand ur point of view. Pure str is awsome. Now try to understand my view.

[NuclearSilo]

in what server?

[Hasbin]

Im in Venice.

[cin]

does 70:70 count as a int hybrid?

[Da_Realest]

Not discussing with u anymore, u keep saying the same things lol.

It seems that way because you don't understand.

And yes i sacrified hp, but still got (will have, see my sig:going 70:70) enough hp to survive 1 or 2 nukes if im in garments, and survive a crit or 2 of a glavier.

I doubt you can survive more than one critical from a glaive.

After that ill start running, no need to stand and tank. Use the almighty grass walk to give me sec more to pot and go ranged again.
And i know u are gonna say, the opponent will use grass walk too, but he cant predict where im going. So ill have a 1 sec head start.

1 sec is nothing. He is still potting while you're running also, which negate the damage you did. If you literally mean 1 second, then thats not much time to pot up much health at all.

Remember the song: If at first u dont succeed, dust urself off and try again.
And i u are so in with tanking, blader would fit u very good.

I have a pure int spear, str hybrid bow, pure str glaive, and a pure str blade. I think I know what each build needs to survive against each other.

And for the 3rd time im not planning on going 1vs1 too much.

And for the 3rd time when in job wars and guild wars everyone is going to come after you first.

And look at liquidsmooth for the str hybrid crit, thats ur proof.

Any build can do well with a sos+5 weapon.

Now stop saying all the things u said once again, i understand ur point of view. Pure str is awsome. Now try to understand my view.

Obviously you don't understand if you think I keep saying the same thing over and over. And no, I never said pure str was awesome. You just assumed that.

[NuclearSilo]

Not again.
It's the same debate as this thread
http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=24752

[Da_Realest]

Not again.
It's the same debate as this thread
http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=24752

Yup, all bow topics turn out like that.

Everyone wants the best bow build so every bow topic turns into a big debate.

[cin]

lol and the debate will never ever end -.-

[HBblade]

ppl should start thinking logically about how to build hybrids

bow=low def, low hp, lower attk, no skill effects (other than crit), AR (though i really doubt AR really helps much)
spear=low def, higher hp, higher attk, stun, kb, 15s mag.buff
sword=higher def, low hp(a bit higher than bow), higher attk than bow, kd+stab, block, 15s phy.buff

these are the sole reasons why a pure int/hybrid is better suited w/ a spear or sword/shield

even a pure str bow has a hard time in pvp w/ the extra hp & all, i doubt a pure int/hybrid bow will have a easier time

[NuclearSilo]

Whatever u say, 5.4k HP at that lvl is not enough HP to survive during 1vs1.
Want i tell u about my char
Lv 62, sword+4, 5.2k HP, phy def 555, mag def 947, shield br 17. And still have hard time against other build.
glaiver weapon+5 ---> soul + chain + ghost spear = death
bow str ---> pot fight
blader ----> pot fight
hybrid spear ---> this guy is as strong as glaiver+5, but die if i KD
sword fully pimped gear ---> nuke me 4.0k dmg, but take around 4 nukes to kill me.

So, i wonder how can a weak defense bow can fight in this situation. I doubt u can kill that glaiver in 2 skills even if u use bow+5
(power bow+5 = glaive +2)