Bow build 70:70 GUIDE Updated 3.0!

[Zing]

I don't see why we should even compare the damage to spear. The spear should obviously do more damage. Even though the damage is higher with spear, it does not mean it's better to switch to spear.

This goes the same with pure STR bowman and glaive. Glaive obviously does higher damage than the STR bowman. And, still that doesn't mean you should switch to glaive.

When you get the advantage of range, you sacrifice something for it.
Glaive and spear will always be the harder hitters.

[Charlotte]

I don't see why we should even compare the damage to spear. The spear should obviously do more damage. Even though the damage is higher with spear, it does not mean it's better to switch to spear.

This goes the same with pure STR bowman and glaive. Glaive obviously does higher damage than the STR bowman. And, still that doesn't mean you should switch to glaive.

When you get the advantage of range, you sacrifice something for it.
Glaive and spear will always be the harder hitters.

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

[hab6ft8]

Gotta quote the sig...i have been saying that since i started playing...everyone knows the only people that butcher the english language worse that koreans are turks...but koreans do a nice job for second place

btw for all u nubs, its Glaive not Glavie. wtf is a glavie? stupid translators.

[Alfred]

Gotta quote the sig...i have been saying that since i started playing...everyone knows the only people that butcher the english language worse that koreans are turks...but koreans do a nice job for second place

btw for all u nubs, its Glaive not Glavie. wtf is a glavie? stupid translators.

wrong topic

and who cares?

[Da_Realest]

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

Simple. Its not all about damage. Bow is the only str based weapon with range meaning you can tank better and kill faster than other str builds. If you mean in terms of being a 70:70, then you have farther range with a bow and it does make a difference. If you were to nuke with spear then what would be the purpose of creating a 70:70 bow topic?

[glavie]

Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?[/b]
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

I think this is a valid point. As far as i can tell the bow shoots 4.4m farther than a nuke with the break heaven buff.
Without the buff its the same distance right?

I Wanna Be Made, could you do an experiment and buy a NPC spear and NPC bow. and test the damage difference between a spear nuke, and a strong bow.

Also what is the difference between the nuke and a antidevil crit and a strong bow crit.

I rather gamble on a crit +extra distance, over a nuke if the crit is decently more powerful.

[NuclearSilo]

Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?[/b]
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

I think this is a valid point. As far as i can tell the bow shoots 4.4m farther than a nuke with the break heaven buff.
Without the buff its the same distance right?

I Wanna Be Made, could you do an experiment and buy a NPC spear and NPC bow. and test the damage difference between a spear nuke, and a strong bow.

Also what is the difference between the nuke and a antidevil crit and a strong bow crit.

I rather gamble on a crit +extra distance, over a nuke if the crit is decently more powerful.

I didnt test this but i think while using demon soul arrow +4.4m, u'll have bonuse distance attack no matter the weapon u use. I mean that even if u nuke with spear, u'll have +4.4m attack distance with the buff.
Comparing nuke with strongbow doesnt make any sense since strongbow has 350% boost while nuke has 300% boost. It's normal if u find that strongbow deal more damage.

[DS^]

Will this 70:70 build also work with a spear ??

[Eukanuba]

I think this is a valid point. As far as i can tell the bow shoots 4.4m farther than a nuke with the break heaven buff.
Without the buff its the same distance right?

I tried using the hawk buff with a lion shout. It made no difference in range. I didn't bother spending the points on a nuke to test it out, but inductive reasoning says it won't work with that, either. By all means, try it out and see. Hell, go try it with the ranged attacks on the other weapons, too.

[FuryAngle]

@eukanuba-Hawks dont affect range.

And the 67 archer is now still an archer but I will Also farm for 4-7days more to level the nukes after I tested the archer. I have a feeing the Nukes will be more effective than the bow. This is because My fried is lvl 79 with equal HP/MP and he nukes a 7x in 2 hits and is dead. So I will give it a try to both sides. I guess Im spending even more silk now U idiots better be thankfull...

[glavie]

Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?[/b]
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

I think this is a valid point. As far as i can tell the bow shoots 4.4m farther than a nuke with the break heaven buff.
Without the buff its the same distance right?

I Wanna Be Made, could you do an experiment and buy a NPC spear and NPC bow. and test the damage difference between a spear nuke, and a strong bow.

Also what is the difference between the nuke and a antidevil crit and a strong bow crit.

I rather gamble on a crit +extra distance, over a nuke if the crit is decently more powerful.

I didnt test this but i think while using demon soul arrow +4.4m, u'll have bonuse distance attack no matter the weapon u use. I mean that even if u nuke with spear, u'll have +4.4m attack distance with the buff.
Comparing nuke with strongbow doesnt make any sense since strongbow has 350% boost while nuke has 300% boost. It's normal if u find that strongbow deal more damage.

The question is how much weaker is a strong bow/ anti devil when compared to a nuke from a spear. I wannaBe Made already demonstrated that a nuke from a bow is less.
In addition How does a crit on a antidevil compare to a nuke from a spear?

If the nuke is signifcantly stronger than it brings up the question as to wether you would be better off a 70:70 spear.

[Zing]

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

Hahaha, what? Many high level pure STR bowman players are switching to glaive. Because it gives them better overall survival in PVP. Now, why are we comparing this build to spear? Because, we want to know which does more damage, hence giving the idea of what survives better in PVP.

With the extra range, you are able to unleash one skill before the spear nuker can get into range. By the time the spear nuker actually gets into range, the bowman should be all ready submitting his second skill.

Sure, the spear nuker does harder damage, but they do not have the necessity of the longer range of which bowman has.

As I said, you trade something for something. Damage isn't everything.

[NuclearSilo]

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

Hahaha, what? Many high level pure STR bowman players are switching to glaive. Because it gives them better overall survival in PVP. Now, why are we comparing this build to spear? Because, we want to know which does more damage, hence giving the idea of what survives better in PVP.

With the extra range, you are able to unleash one skill before the spear nuker can get into range. By the time the spear nuker actually gets into range, the bowman should be all ready submitting his second skill.

Sure, the spear nuker does harder damage, but they do not have the necessity of the longer range of which bowman has.

As I said, you trade something for something. Damage isn't everything.

Stop that discussion about spear/glaive already -.-
Bow is not a class for 1vs1!!! So if u want pvp go heuksal and bicheon. There are many reasons that can convince u to switch to spear & glaive. So what's the reason of choosing bow?
- because u love bow
- because bow's lvling speed fast
- because bow has far range so u can kill mob before it reaches u
- because bow fights pretty well in group of fight like war job, war guild

Generally, bow needs damage, but dont need tanking because there are others class help it to tank => damage > survivability
=> let's discuss about something else than pvp plz

[Da_Realest]

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

Hahaha, what? Many high level pure STR bowman players are switching to glaive. Because it gives them better overall survival in PVP. Now, why are we comparing this build to spear? Because, we want to know which does more damage, hence giving the idea of what survives better in PVP.

With the extra range, you are able to unleash one skill before the spear nuker can get into range. By the time the spear nuker actually gets into range, the bowman should be all ready submitting his second skill.

Sure, the spear nuker does harder damage, but they do not have the necessity of the longer range of which bowman has.

As I said, you trade something for something. Damage isn't everything.

Stop that discussion about spear/glaive already -.-
Bow is not a class for 1vs1!!! So if u want pvp go heuksal and bicheon. There are many reasons that can convince u to switch to spear & glaive. So what's the reason of choosing bow?
- because u love bow
- because bow's lvling speed fast
- because bow has far range so u can kill mob before it reaches u
- because bow fights pretty well in group of fight like war job, war guild

Generally, bow needs damage, but dont need tanking because there are others class help it to tank => damage > survivability
=> let's discuss about something else than pvp plz

You still need hp to tank whether you want it or not. Since you are bow everyone will come after you first since you die the fastest. Since you are 70:70 when 1 or 2 people attack you'll probably go down before you can finish using your 3rd skill if you get that far.

[Charlotte]

Distance Buff is only for Bow, nothing more guys. Even you buff it up, you still nuke in the default range.
70:70 is close to 1:2 ratio, and 1:2 ratio work well with spear.

[NuclearSilo]

Don't give an example about glaive and bow, because glaive is for melee and bow is for range. The current question here is :
Why do you have to shoot with a bow when you can nuke with a spear and still have the advantage of range ?
Of course bow's range is farther than nuke, but do you know that you nuke harder than shoot ?

Hahaha, what? Many high level pure STR bowman players are switching to glaive. Because it gives them better overall survival in PVP. Now, why are we comparing this build to spear? Because, we want to know which does more damage, hence giving the idea of what survives better in PVP.

With the extra range, you are able to unleash one skill before the spear nuker can get into range. By the time the spear nuker actually gets into range, the bowman should be all ready submitting his second skill.

Sure, the spear nuker does harder damage, but they do not have the necessity of the longer range of which bowman has.

As I said, you trade something for something. Damage isn't everything.

Stop that discussion about spear/glaive already -.-
Bow is not a class for 1vs1!!! So if u want pvp go heuksal and bicheon. There are many reasons that can convince u to switch to spear & glaive. So what's the reason of choosing bow?
- because u love bow
- because bow's lvling speed fast
- because bow has far range so u can kill mob before it reaches u
- because bow fights pretty well in group of fight like war job, war guild

Generally, bow needs damage, but dont need tanking because there are others class help it to tank => damage > survivability
=> let's discuss about something else than pvp plz

You still need hp to tank whether you want it or not. Since you are bow everyone will come after you first since you die the fastest. Since you are 70:70 when 1 or 2 people attack you'll probably go down before you can finish using your 3rd skill if you get that far.

If u reason that way, then tell me why ppl go for pure int, at lvl 70, with 3.9HP or hybrid 1:2? Since nuker>bowman, ppl will jump on nuker first. Nuker wont even have time to launch 2 nukes... Note that a 70:70 has much more HP than any kind of nuker with mag balance > 80%.
But a bow wont staying in the same place to let ppl hit. Its strategy is hit and run. If ppl chase u, u run and your other bow friends with kill them when they dont pay attantion. Because bow attack from far distance, it will kill the enemy before the enemy can notice its presence. Just think of 5 bowers using devil arrow skill on a glaiver....For exemple, the battle begins with 5vs5, but a glavier died => 5vs4; as soon as the 4 glaivers can reach the bowers, another glaiver falls down. The real battle begins with 5v3...and so on.

[Zing]

You still need hp to tank whether you want it or not. Since you are bow everyone will come after you first since you die the fastest. Since you are 70:70 when 1 or 2 people attack you'll probably go down before you can finish using your 3rd skill if you get that far.

They'd go for pure INT, first. Pure INT are closer, as they need to be, because of their range for nuking. Also, their health being the lowest and especially known for their hard damage dealing.

It'd be much more of a difficulty when hunting down the bowman, since the distance of their range is significantly longer.

[Da_Realest]

If u reason that way, then tell me why ppl go for pure int, at lvl 70, with 3.9HP or hybrid 1:2? Since nuker>bowman, ppl will jump on nuker first. Nuker wont even have time to launch 2 nukes...

1. Of course people will go after nukers first. They are a much bigger threat than you. They know they risk dying first and don't complain and try to make a new build because of it.
2. Hybrids don't die fast. Hybrids can run, kd, block, castle shield, bloody fan storm, stun, knockback and a hp passive, depending on the int hybrid. What can your 70:70 bow do? Run?

Note that a 70:70 has much more HP than any kind of nuker with mag balance > 80%.

You're not a nuker. You can't kill as fast as them. A int sword nuker can kd, block, and use castle shield. They don't need the hp. A spear nuker can knockback with ghost spear, stun, and also have the hp passive. They also don't need the hp.

But a bow wont staying in the same place to let ppl hit. Its strategy is hit and run. If ppl chase u, u run and your other bow friends with kill them when they dont pay attantion. Because bow attack from far distance, it will kill the enemy before the enemy can notice its presence.

People safe zone fight. They will stay in safe zone. They will ghost walk and kill archers and nukers first. You're not going to have time to react if they ghost walk out. You can't run when you're stunned, kded, or stopped by a ghost spear. Since you're 70:70, if 2 people of any build(Maybe can survive bladers) attack you, you're dead.

Sorry but archers cannot kill that fast. The only thing you can kill without the enemy noticing your present is spear nukers. The only ranged str that can kill str characters fast is the European Crossbow.

If you want real teamwork then wait for Europe. They are designed for teamwork. Chinese characters are designed for solo play. A 70:70 bow will not solo as well as a str heavy bow build.

Just think of 5 bowers using devil arrow skill on a glaiver....For exemple, the battle begins with 5vs5, but a glavier died => 5vs4; as soon as the 4 glaivers can reach the bowers, another glaiver falls down. The real battle begins with 5v3...and so on.

That can be said about any build. 5 bladers are dangerous. If someone gets kded then they will get stabbed to death. 5 nukers are dangerous. Who ever 3 of them target is instantly dead. 5 glaivers are dangerous. A soul spear and ghost spear from about 3 of them will bring down anyone of equal lvl and alchemy.

[Eukanuba]

@eukanuba-Hawks dont affect range.

Whoops, you're right.

I was having a brain fart when I wrote that. I was using the pierce heaven buff when I tried it out.

[keny_paintball]

Jade just show us a video of you pving ,,, then mabe i will trun my bow into a 70:70 build ^^

[hab6ft8]

Jade just show us a video of you pving ,,, then mabe i will trun my bow into a 70:70 build ^^

+1

lemme see it and ill buy it...ok i wont but i promise i wont always talk bad about bows...

i was even hybrid bow....stopped at 34 cause i lagged out and died too much...switched to blade...get fraps or camtasia....i am gonna frap a nuker fighting me next week...along with me beating a devil yeti 1v1...

[Ell]

Holy crap this is still going?

[Vegetto]

@I.WANNA.BE.MADE lol wow nice dude you get the 80:80 balance on lvl 48... would you do us a favour and go pvp some ppl and make some vids of your fights ?
would be nice to see how it work on lvl 48 :) on pvp

a small video^^ its my first one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1K888BgiyZo

well there guys is the video ...
i think i wanna be made posted his pvp video already (he is 80:80 and fighting against full str bow in garment ...on my opinion)

Well i think this build has potential, but against a blader/glavier wouldnt be easy !
But well :) nice theory Jadekiss
we just need some vids more

[DS^]

wil this build also work with a spear ???

[Da_Realest]

@I.WANNA.BE.MADE lol wow nice dude you get the 80:80 balance on lvl 48... would you do us a favour and go pvp some ppl and make some vids of your fights ?
would be nice to see how it work on lvl 48 on pvp

a small video^^ its my first one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1K888BgiyZo

well there guys is the video ...
i think i wanna be made posted his pvp video already (he is 80:80 and fighting against full str bow in garment ...on my opinion)

Well i think this build has potential, but against a blader/glavier wouldnt be easy !
But well nice theory Jadekiss
we just need some vids more

He has fire wall up and armor and still is almost dying. I guarantee that if the str had armor on also or if I.WANNA.BE.MADE wore garment or protector he would have lost.

[Eukanuba]

He has fire wall up and armor and still is almost dying. I guarantee that if the str had armor on also or if I.WANNA.BE.MADE wore garment or protector he would have lost.

Geeze. While you're at it, why not criticize him for using skills instead of auto attack. It shouldn't matter which skills or protection class you use, as all of those things are equally available to the each player without depending on luck.

If you are going to say that he sucks because he almost died, then you have to say the str archer sucks even harder for losing to him.

That being said, the mere fact that he's an 80:80 means I.WANNA.BE.MADE has considerable alchemic properties on his equipment. The PvP video, as the known facts are now, only shows that someone with good alchemy won a couple fights.

[Da_Realest]

He has fire wall up and armor and still is almost dying. I guarantee that if the str had armor on also or if I.WANNA.BE.MADE wore garment or protector he would have lost.

Geeze. While you're at it, why not criticize him for using skills instead of auto attack. It shouldn't matter which skills or protection class you use, as all of those things are equally available to the each player without depending on luck.

If you are going to say that he sucks because he almost died, then you have to say the str archer sucks even harder for losing to him.

That being said, the mere fact that he's an 80:80 means I.WANNA.BE.MADE has considerable alchemic properties on his equipment. The PvP video, as the known facts are now, only shows that someone with good alchemy won a couple fights.

The point was to prove which build is better. The fighting ground was not equal. Of course the pure str is going to do significant less damage because his opponent is using armor. You're only saying this because you know if they had the same gear the 70:70 bow would lose. Don't believe me? Tell them to wear npc gear except for weapon and I guarantee the pure str will win.

The protection you wear does matter. Wearing armor or garment is the difference between life and death for int builds and pretty much all builds. Of course they are equally available but when you're trying to prove something like this the playing field needs to be near equal.

[NuclearSilo]

Tell them to wear npc gear except for weapon and I guarantee the pure str will win.

Why except for weapon? Arent we comparing build but not item?

[Da_Realest]

Tell them to wear npc gear except for weapon and I guarantee the pure str will win.

Why except for weapon? Arent we comparing build but not item?

Well, npc weapon or not. The outcome will be the same.

[Eukanuba]

The point was to prove which build is better. The fighting ground was not equal. Of course the pure str is going to do significant less damage because his opponent is using armor. You're only saying this because you know if they had the same gear the 70:70 bow would lose. Don't believe me? Tell them to wear npc gear except for weapon and I guarantee the pure str will win.

The protection you wear does matter. Wearing armor or garment is the difference between life and death for int builds and pretty much all builds. Of course they are equally available but when you're trying to prove something like this the playing field needs to be near equal.

You fail at logic and reading comprehension.

You are criticizing him because he chooses to wear armor. Big deal. It doesn't matter what protector class he chooses. You must have a very bad memory, because right before you say "the playing field needs to be near equal" (which I am in agreement with), you say, "Of course [armor, protectors, and garments] are equally available..."

Equal availability is one of the most important things that level the playing field. You even used the words "equally" and "equal" to describe each situation and in the same sentence.

The type of protection he chooses to use is as much a part of his character as the stat distribution. Yes, it does matter in terms of partiality. It does not matter in terms of what is fair or not. What DOES need to be addressed his is use of alchemy, but you made no mention of that and instead whined that he was using armor against a str build. Your bias is evident when you imply that the hybrid should not be allowed to wear armor against a str build. To be completely fair in this situation, you should have proposed that they fight naked, which is actually not a bad idea. If the class of gear someone is going to use must be dictated by others, then EVERY build has the great potential to suck.

Again, if you are going to say that he sucks for almost dying (which, by the way, took place without fire shield and he did not yet pot back up to full HP after the first fight like his opponent most likely did), then you have to acknowledge that the str archer he fought sucks even harder for losing to him. If you are not willing to admit that, then you are clearly incapable of offering impartial insight on the matter.

I will again reiterate that I do not believe the video is proof of anything other than the fact that alchemy is helpful. Without knowing the information for both characters, trying to say one sucks over the other is moot, as no comparison can be drawn.