Bow build 70:70 GUIDE Updated 3.0!

[Dempster]

my point is, whether it crits or not the damage won't move much.. it'd be a "mediocre" crit ^^

it doesn't have to, the damage is high enough from the beginning

Uh. that 350% is physical damage, which this build doesn't have much of..

the mag damage from the imbue is affected by this also

so you have 350% Physical + 100% magical, okay? now lets sit back, look at the numbers and maybe just maybe realize that 350 is greater than 100. Hmmmm? For those of us who are sane this probably means that str will have much more of an impact than int will... But I already know you are going to claim that this move does more as an int build, a lvl 80 "70:70" char well, it would be 70:69 nude, would have 192str 243int or 191str 244int.. (69:70), this build has a great deal more int than it does str. The build does have higher average damage compared to a str bow's damage without taking criticals into account

12958 Hp is the absolute maximum for a "70:70" archer at lv80 with PERFECT gear.
19889 Hp is the maximum for a pure strength archer at lvl 80.
(note these are both without the hp scrolls and spear mastery.)

My arguement is that the pure str would be able to easily pot past the medicore damage of this "Best bow build 2007", and kill him in an Devil Arrow + Antidevil-Steel.

[Jadekiss]

I wonder:
Why ppl still thank me for this guide after they reach their char on lvl 42+
Why did they tell me this kind of build is amazing in pve and pvp...
Why did they tell me the owned a lot of ppl on same lvl also glaviers ?

I think this build is pretty good maybe not the best one ok i agree with that point but comparable with a full str bow maybe even better than a full str bow.

HP and Crit arent equally with a full str.. ok
but what is this build can kill your enemy with your high damage + range bonus before your enemy reach you ?

hmm im still waiting here for Wind's guide
i hope he keep his word !

[DeRanged]

Has Wind Got back to you on when he is going to be posting in here?

[Jadekiss]

I talked with him and wanted to make a vid of him in pvp
but he said i should wait and he will post his guide + vid in this forum
he should post this week .... but right now no post =/ i will leave him a message to see whats wrong with him

[Slayer007]

hey jadekiss ive been thinking about ur 70:70 build and i was wandering if there only good in pvp at high lvl or throught lvling there good b/c i recently made a bow char and i kinda wanna try out ur build to see if its really good like my glavie build

[Jadekiss]

Hey Slayer007 this char rocks on PvE but PvP im not sure
but the ppl who are trying this build out right now still like it !
pve and pvp, they said its amazing so build your own opinion on it !

[PsYch008]

i am gonna try out your build on the new server, thanks for the idea bro. sounds like a fun new thing to try in stead of all the cookie cutter builds ^^

[Jadekiss]

yeah but everyone has their own opinion on this build !
but who cares if you like it than stick and the build and go on

[Alfred]

my point is, whether it crits or not the damage won't move much.. it'd be a "mediocre" crit ^^

it doesn't have to, the damage is high enough from the beginning

Uh. that 350% is physical damage, which this build doesn't have much of..

the mag damage from the imbue is affected by this also

so you have 350% Physical + 100% magical, okay? now lets sit back, look at the numbers and maybe just maybe realize that 350 is greater than 100. Hmmmm? For those of us who are sane this probably means that str will have much more of an impact than int will... But I already know you are going to claim that this move does more as an int build, a lvl 80 "70:70" char well, it would be 70:69 nude, would have 192str 243int or 191str 244int.. (69:70), this build has a great deal more int than it does str. The build does have higher average damage compared to a str bow's damage without taking criticals into account

Could you please enlighten me how the damage is calculated. I can only go by what I see with my character. I don't claim either this and that. All I know is that I do alot more magical damage with strong bow then my other skills.

[judaiskariot]

yeah can somebody explain cause i dont understand it wery well.

i have now with all my gear balance of 67:97 (have to put more str on all and I am puting all pts on str from now on and it means lvl 61 - 80.. so please no flames - if you want to flame go back few pages i got it enough allready)..

So I realy want to know is that ph dmg 350% only for full str or it is for any build, and does int dmg adds to that dmg or it makes it weaker (i mean more int mean less then ph 350%)..

and yes for PVE this build realy rocks.. even with my build i have something over 5k of hp and can tank shakrams and edimus realy nicely, and i kill very quickly (just to mention i have gap 7 now and still farming).

[tomiotar]

my point is, whether it crits or not the damage won't move much.. it'd be a "mediocre" crit ^^

it doesn't have to, the damage is high enough from the beginning

Uh. that 350% is physical damage, which this build doesn't have much of..

the mag damage from the imbue is affected by this also

so you have 350% Physical + 100% magical, okay?

That is wrong, maybe its a bug but that 350% affected both phys and mag attacks. If you have any doubt about this you should make a pure int bow up to lvl 15 (so the attacks difference will be big enough) and check it. Ive been cheking this during all my build. My physical and magical attack are almost the same during a normal imbued arrow and when I use my weapon skills. When I crit in any imbued attack (including normal and skill attacks) I add a 50% damage to my attacks always.

[judaiskariot]

ok just for reference:

I have 60 +4 full blue bow crit 10 (balance 67:97) and 7 lvls gap. I have Anti-devil bow 3d book on lvl 3..
and I make to edimus crit over 4k..

So does that means 250% + int what??

can anyone calculate this for me or explain does it add or not..

[Da_Realest]

So I realy want to know is that ph dmg 350% only for full str or it is for any build, and does int dmg adds to that dmg or it makes it weaker (i mean more int mean less then ph 350%)..

Its just for str. Int does not effect it. The only damage skills effected by int are nukes and imbue.

That is wrong, maybe its a bug but that 350% affected both phys and mag attacks. If you have any doubt about this you should make a pure int bow up to lvl 15 (so the attacks difference will be big enough) and check it. Ive been cheking this during all my build. My physical and magical attack are almost the same during a normal imbued arrow and when I use my weapon skills. When I crit in any imbued attack (including normal and skill attacks) I add a 50% damage to my attacks always.

You're wrong. The problem is you're character lvl is too low to see a difference. The percents are too close at low lvls so of course you won't see much of a difference. Without imbue, a pure int a degree higher than you would have a hard time killing you with just weapon skills. They probably won't kill you.

You're saying there isn't a big difference between a 7x int spear hybrid doing about 800-1k damage without imbue with ghost spear mars and about 6k-7k with imbue with ghost spear mars?

[violence1234]

Jadekiss, your build seems very nice for PvE as too many users here say. But I have a question, do I have to use a very good bow to do nice in PvE ? I mean if I only use a normal +3 bow, can I kill monsters fast before they reach me ?
Because I'm new to this game, and bows have a very high price, I can't even buy a Seal Of Star.

[Da_Realest]

Jadekiss, your build seems very nice for PvE as too many users here say. But I have a question, do I have to use a very good bow to do nice in PvE ? I mean if I only use a normal +3 bow, can I kill monsters fast before they reach me ?
Because I'm new to this game, and bows have a very high price, I can't even buy a Seal Of Star.

You can kill mobs before they get to you with a pure str archer with a +3 bow but it is easier to kill them before they get to you with the 70:70 archer.

[Eukanuba]

You're wrong. The problem is you're character lvl is too low to see a difference. The percents are too close at low lvls so of course you won't see much of a difference. Without imbue, a pure int a degree higher than you would have a hard time killing you with just weapon skills. They probably won't kill you.

You're saying there isn't a big difference between a 7x int spear hybrid doing about 800-1k damage without imbue with ghost spear mars and about 6k-7k with imbue with ghost spear mars?

I think tomiotar is trying to say that the imbue's power is affected by the skill. I'm not really certain what you are getting at, but to be honest I'm kind of spacing out at the moment, so that might be by fault.

Comparing the effects of a low level character vs another low level character can indeed lead to incorrect conclusions as you stated, I can see nothing wrong with comparing the character to itself. I did this a short while back with a low level pure int character (I think around 14 at the time):

- using a bow, perform ten or more of the following and average the results
- regular attack (a)
- regular, imbued attack (b)
- anti devil bow (c)
- imbued anti devil bow (d)
-subtract (a) from (b) so that we are left with the average damage done by the imbue alone. This will become (e)
-subtract (c) from (d) to find the damage done with the imbue alone during the anti-devil skill. This will be (f)
- compare (e) and (f). If they are not either equal or almost equal (a five percent discrpency over or under seems fair, right?), then clearly the skill has affected the power of the imbue as well.

I am aware that the skill description says that weapon skills only affect physical damage, but this would not be the first time joymax has been wrong about their own game. As tomiotar said, this could indeed be a bug that is waiting to be fixed.

[Alfred]

berserker arrow without imbue: 1020


berserker arrow with imbue: 2637


strong bow without imbue: 1692


strong bow with imbue: 4738


there ya go

as you can clearly see, the strong bow's imbue adds up alot more magical damage

[Jadekiss]

Alfred is that your 70:70 bow ? or what kind of build are you showing there on the screen ?
just wonder how the strong bow skills get a damage with imbue which is more than doubble so strong than withouth it !

[Pro_user911]

this build is no good ^___^

by doing this u only has around or less than 9k hp

and jadekiss aege is not the 1st server which came out-.-

xian is the 1st server which came out with naked characters (while creating character u can them naked)

at lvl 71 u will hav a lot of hp lesser than others.

i had a character which is builded this way too.i do not kill people easily and i get owned easily.

At lvl 37 i got 1.8k hp and 3k mp.
its like a hybird int too.
u should not make the % of str and int same because if u do that u die easily.
when a lvl 37 glavie crits i will die in no time.

and if u do that build in lvl 71 u will die in 1 nuke.thats the worst thing ever.

[Dempster]

interesting, But i still doubt you'd ever be able to kill a pure str before he kills you.

[Dempster]

and jadekiss aege is not the 1st server which came out-.-

xian is the 1st server which came out with naked characters (while creating character u can them naked)

Hmmm, I'm going to see if i can remember the login for my first char on xian... was 43 I think

[tomiotar]

You're wrong. The problem is you're character lvl is too low to see a difference. The percents are too close at low lvls so of course you won't see much of a difference. Without imbue, a pure int a degree higher than you would have a hard time killing you with just weapon skills. They probably won't kill you.

You're saying there isn't a big difference between a 7x int spear hybrid doing about 800-1k damage without imbue with ghost spear mars and about 6k-7k with imbue with ghost spear mars?[/color]

I said to prepare a low level char just for check it. Im lvl 60 now with a 81-71 balance, my lower phys attack is ~1050 and my lowervmag attack is ~1070, so I think that Im using numbers big enough (when I zerk for yetis giants I do 10-11K damage on them when I crit antidevil, 6-7k without crit).

My damage come on 50% of physical and 50% of magical and Ive checked this several times. If the description is wrong or we are not interpreting correctly could be another point. Antidevil steel say that add Physical attack power 147~199(250%) Critical 30 increase. I think that exactly that it do is add this ammount just to the base physical damage (for me is 15 to 20% extra phys damage), and increase for 250% both attack at the end.

Some other way to check its comparing the pure str blader against the pure int sword, using a weapon skill (KD tipically). A pure int sword should not made a lot of extra damage for 250% of physical damage, but I think that if we compare the KD damage of pure int its higher than the same from a pure str blader. The same applied for the classical 1:2 int spear doing their weapons skill. Why they do such amount of damage if they dont include de extra % to the magycal attack?

Next time I will make the screenshot to show the damages on yetis.

[metroAID]

You're wrong. The problem is you're character lvl is too low to see a difference. The percents are too close at low lvls so of course you won't see much of a difference. Without imbue, a pure int a degree higher than you would have a hard time killing you with just weapon skills. They probably won't kill you.

You're saying there isn't a big difference between a 7x int spear hybrid doing about 800-1k damage without imbue with ghost spear mars and about 6k-7k with imbue with ghost spear mars?

I think tomiotar is trying to say that the imbue's power is affected by the skill. I'm not really certain what you are getting at, but to be honest I'm kind of spacing out at the moment, so that might be by fault.
.

it is. im comparing this with my pure STR glaiver and my other STR type hybrid glaiver. (same lvl, naked balance all, even same NPC gears) imbue's does affect physical skills. and my STR hybrid deals great damage.

[Da_Realest]

You're wrong. The problem is you're character lvl is too low to see a difference. The percents are too close at low lvls so of course you won't see much of a difference. Without imbue, a pure int a degree higher than you would have a hard time killing you with just weapon skills. They probably won't kill you.

You're saying there isn't a big difference between a 7x int spear hybrid doing about 800-1k damage without imbue with ghost spear mars and about 6k-7k with imbue with ghost spear mars?[/color]

I said to prepare a low level char just for check it. Im lvl 60 now with a 81-71 balance, my lower phys attack is ~1050 and my lowervmag attack is ~1070, so I think that Im using numbers big enough (when I zerk for yetis giants I do 10-11K damage on them when I crit antidevil, 6-7k without crit).

My damage come on 50% of physical and 50% of magical and Ive checked this several times. If the description is wrong or we are not interpreting correctly could be another point. Antidevil steel say that add Physical attack power 147~199(250%) Critical 30 increase. I think that exactly that it do is add this ammount just to the base physical damage (for me is 15 to 20% extra phys damage), and increase for 250% both attack at the end.

Some other way to check its comparing the pure str blader against the pure int sword, using a weapon skill (KD tipically). A pure int sword should not made a lot of extra damage for 250% of physical damage, but I think that if we compare the KD damage of pure int its higher than the same from a pure str blader. The same applied for the classical 1:2 int spear doing their weapons skill. Why they do such amount of damage if they dont include de extra % to the magycal attack?

Next time I will make the screenshot to show the damages on yetis.

The % behind the attack not only has something to do with the power of the skill but the speed that it takes for the skill to execute. A pure int sword will do less damage than a pure str blade with kd without imbue. The reason a pure int does more with imbue is because the game is designed so that 1% int is stronger than 1% str in terms of power and worth. That is why pure str characters have a very low int balance of about 27% and a pure int has a str balance of about 50% because of the way the game values each of the stats.

[Eukanuba]

Alright, here's some more stuff for all to chew on.

I repeated my little experiment following the steps I posted above. I used my sucky archer character with whom I now just use to get gold and screw around with. Here are the stats:

lvl 42
Str: 184
Int:95
Phy atk: 492 ~ 592
Mag atk: 488 ~585
Phy bal: 95
Mag bal: 48
Hit Ratio: 200

I didn't include defense or parry ratio stats because they were not important to this test. I mention this because I'm sure if I don't, someone will ask why I did not list them.

Skills used:
Anti devil bow - wave lvl 4
Phy attack power 77 ~ 104 (200%) crit 25 increase
Extreme Fire Force lvl 2
Mag attack power 68 ~ 114 (100%)

Results (averages of ten bow attacks, rounded to the nearest whole number):
regular attacks: 603 (a)
imbued attacks: 1068 (b)
anti-devil bow: 1764 (c)
imbued anti-devil: 2892 (d)

Subtracting (a) from (b) will give us the damage caused by the imbue itself (e) when used with a regular attack. This number is 465

Subtracting (c) from (d) will give us the damage caused by the imbue itself when used with the Anti-Devil bow skill (see above for full skill details) which will be called (f). In this case, the value of (f) is 1128.

465 < 1128, which clearly illustrates that the skill had a tremendous effect on the power of the imbue.

Edit: Forgot to mention these numbers were recorded on Mangyangs

[Bowman]

ok in conclusion it is quite obvious that that a 70:70 is better at pve but not in pvp due to its lack of hp. In pvp a 70:70 does more damage but still not enough to kill a glaiver fast enough to survive. A pure str bower last longer in pvp but doesnt dish out enough damg to kill a glaiver or blader. I am a 75 archer that is pure str and i have to admit that eventho i can tank glaivers and bladers its usually a pot fight and i die due to crits and kd. Therefore in my experience pure str and 70:70 are not the best in pvp. Thus in my opinion, it is actually the heavy str hybrid that is best build for bowman in pvp. A str hybrid means putting 5-10 lvls into all int. This means losing 1-1.5k hp @ lvl 80 but it brings your magic balance to around 45% with lots of int alchemy. This will allow greater consistent damage without losing survivibility and crit damage in pvp.

[Pro_user911]

i tink mod shuld close this topic and delete this thread.its a waste of time because these hybird 70% : 70% does not really works well.any new players who tried this build will cry and quit this game or restart character for sure.

70%,70% wont make u own u die easily and it is not recommended to do such stuff.
i saw a post being deleted or edit. a SS which show lvl 71 char with 70% and 70% with (-90 stat) and with only 9k+ mp and 9k+ hp.

so i tink this build sux

[judaiskariot]

lol "thinking is sh.it knowing"..

[Dempster]

i tink mod shuld close this topic and delete this thread.its a waste of time because these hybird 70% : 70% does not really works well.any new players who tried this build will cry and quit this game or restart character for sure.

70%,70% wont make u own u die easily and it is not recommended to do such stuff.
i saw a post being deleted or edit. a SS which show lvl 71 char with 70% and 70% with (-90 stat) and with only 9k+ mp and 9k+ hp.

so i tink this build sux

thats already happened

[Jadekiss]

dont be so arrogant !
You never tried this build out so you cant judge it !
right now there is only 1 of i dont know how many ppl told me that this build bored him/her
lots of ppl wrote me a PM that this build rocks in pve also in pvp
ppl also think full int char sux in pvp ? haha i can say only go and watch some good full int chars with armor against a full str glavier... they can still own them.
so why the **** should a 70:70 balance hybrid sux ?
thats just lame to judge about something if you dont know anything about it !