why an elementary school..

[MrJoey]

So, you know that to give people $100 to give up their fire arms, would tax the hell out of those people right?
Australia had to pay out the ass to collect the guns, their gun related crime rate went up after the ban... think about that and what it means.

Wait, why am I bothering? Thinking isn't penfold's strength. Stop quoting the bastard so I stop seeing his stupidity.

[Aventus]

I could give a shit less if you believe me or not. Half of this has been me playing devils advocate just to piss y'all off and half is true. Getting rid of fun free zones won't work and neither will getting all guns banned. Like all things it needs a balance but if there is one thing the USA has proved it we are a polarized country there can never and will never be balance. Regardless of the status of guns there will always be massacres. It's something you have to be ready for, noone will ever get used to hearing about mass killings but it's something that you can always expect. It happened before the days of guns and will happen after they become a thing of the past. Fixing guns isn't fixing the problem because guns aren't the problem.

My networking professor once said something that I think spans all of life when it comes to security, "the only safe computer is a computer in a safe" basically saying as citizens to be completely safe we would have to lose all of our rights which is not happening.

[penfold1992]

it doesnt matter MrJoey until its your kids that get shot and killed. maybe your opinion will change from the "oh well nothing we can do" when its your children dead rather then the 20 other families that have to suffer because people like you wish to play with big boy guns.

i dont think there needs to or will be a perma ban on guns but the laws need to be much stricter then they are to reduce the amount of guns and ammo being brought by people regardless if they have a good attitude towards them or not.

its like cavemen and fire. the heat, crackle and dance of a flame is wonderful until it sets someone on fire. then again, cavemen probably had more common sense then the gun activists do anyway.

ill sit back and wait till another shooting happens. didnt take long last time.

[Ger_slayer]

:palm: So much in this thread, I feel a lock coming on.

TL;DR 2nd amendment: A country armed is a harder country to take over than an unarmed country.

@Aventus I question your true experience and knowledge of guns, just based off the ignorance you've shown in the area in past threads, but maybe you've gained a lot more knowledge in the last couple months.

@penfold


@Ger_slayer Yes lets do interpret it to our day... oh wait... that's what we do... Back in their time, they had the most effective weapons possible, and they knew what they had them for... Now in our day, we have the most effective weapons we can possibly own under our current laws, and they are still here for the same reason our founders made the 2nd amendment. Just because you live in a world where you don't need a gun, doesn't mean everyone lives in your world.

How many times does it need to be said... Just because you ban guns does not mean guns magically disappear. Guns will still be produced, and even if all of them were banned inside the U.S, they'd just be smuggled in else where... Only person losing their guns are lawful citizens.

Still at the end of the day, all my guns combined(well maybe not my WW2 BRs)have killed less people than Ted Kenndy's car. (lol nostalgia)

Little clip from one of my favorite libertarians. Sums it up.

A) You answer everything else but my question I have asked you, what's with that menz?
B) They aren't interpreted right because gun activists (not all but some) want full auto guns, they want the right a Razor Cat M1911 handgun for conceal and carry.
C) I am a gun person, I like them, I would love to shoot as many guns as possible. That still doesn't mean I should give up my right to feel safe in a movie theater for your right to own a fucking civilian modified ar-15 and shoot people. You don't need a freaking 30 round magazine.
D)You said it your self people are going to steal guns from people who own them, the criminals don't need to get their hands on assault type weapons. Don't let criminals get 30 round magazines so easily. This won't fix the problem all together but it will make it just that much harder for criminals.

[Azilius]

it doesnt matter MrJoey until its your kids that get shot and killed. maybe your opinion will change from the "oh well nothing we can do" when its your children dead rather then the 20 other families that have to suffer because people like you wish to play with big boy guns.

No one said "oh well nothing we can do". Being immature and putting words into other peoples mouths is a sure way to act like a child.

i dont think there needs to or will be a perma ban on guns but the laws need to be much stricter then they are to reduce the amount of guns and ammo being brought by people regardless if they have a good attitude towards them or not.

its like cavemen and fire. the heat, crackle and dance of a flame is wonderful until it sets someone on fire. then again, cavemen probably had more common sense then the gun activists do anyway.

These points have been disputed several times in this topic already and you've yet to rationally refute.

ill sit back and wait till another shooting happens. didnt take long last time.

You don't have another option. The only thing you actually can do is wait. However this is a null point, it serves no purpose other than to attempt to guilt trip people into finding your post reasonable because if not..another shooting!!

In reality, another killing will happen, regardless of guns or lack of guns. Your incredibly narrow minded argument is fixed on applying a band-aid to every single injury rather than finding the cause of the injuries. You are what's wrong with the general population. Had education been better for you your thought process would be much different. Instead it's been manipulated by headlines and emotions. It's not your fault you think this way, but it is your fault that you refuse to accept ANY evidence that might make your opinion wrong. If I didn't know any better I'd say we were atheists arguing about your religion..

[MrTwilliger]

So, you know that to give people $100 to give up their fire arms, would tax the hell out of those people right?
Australia had to pay out the ass to collect the guns, their gun related crime rate went up after the ban... think about that and what it means.

Wait, why am I bothering? Thinking isn't penfold's strength. Stop quoting the bastard so I stop seeing his stupidity.

If you refer to my post on Page 4, you'd see that statistics I posted that show that our gun related fatalities are actually incredibly low. The figures of gun related deaths are on average below 400 per year with 1/2-2/3 of the being suicides as opposed to homicide. I've seen you bash Australia's gun laws, but as a resident of Australia I disagree and the figures from our Statistical Government Agencies show that guns aren't really a dramatic issue here. If I were you I'd back up your claims with some proof before make a comment.

[Love]

7 pages with the same 4 people repeating the same "stuff", time to move on.

Spoiler!

get a life ....

[Rawr]

i dont think there needs to or will be a perma ban on guns but the laws need to be much stricter then they are to reduce the amount of guns and ammo being brought by people regardless if they have a good attitude towards them or not.

I agree. For example anybody could go to a gun show, find a private seller and purchase a gun from him in under 30 seconds. No background check, no questions asked. It's that easy.
I've noticed many stores are pulling their semi automatic rifles from their shelves and online brokers are trimming their selection down.
I'd like to see mag capacity limited as well, there's no reason for any citizen to own a 100+ round drum mag.

I'm done here, just going to wait for a mod to lock it.

[Fury]

Its ok, Big Brother will soon be watching our every move.

[Aventus]

Azil just because another shooting will happen doesn't mean we shouldn't take precautions like no hicap mags. Please for the love of all that is holy do not say "we can just educate people about guns" yea let's teach these guys how to fix a jammed gun so when the miracle happens and the gun jams he can fix it and finish his/her massacre before lunch.

[_Dutchy_]

Azil just because another shooting will happen doesn't mean we shouldn't take precautions like no hicap mags. Please for the love of all that is holy do not say "we can just educate people about guns" yea let's teach these guys how to fix a jammed gun so when the miracle happens and the gun jams he can fix it and finish his/her massacre before lunch.

How about educating the poeple to see when something is wrong with there family members or friends? there should have been signs that these poeple were not mentaly healthy. They didn't see it ? or they just didn't cared?

[Azilius]

Azil just because another shooting will happen doesn't mean we shouldn't take precautions like no hicap mags.

Yes it does.

Please for the love of all that is holy do not say "we can just educate people about guns"

I didn't, but you just did.

yea let's teach these guys how to fix a jammed gun so when the miracle happens and the gun jams he can fix it and finish his/her massacre before lunch.

These are your words not mine. I didn't even say the quote above it. You're arguing against something you made up.

[penfold1992]

do nothing allow people to die

cant wait till it happens to someone you know. oh well, nothing we can do about it. lets just move on.

the most common solution is that we educate people and by the majority of american replies in this thread we can see that its very difficult to educate americans.
heres a quick lesson...
guns kill people.
guns were made to kill people.
guns are produced to kill people.
guns are improved to make sure they kill people.

[*BlackFox]

cant wait till it happens to someone you know.

Don't you ever wish that. I'm Just saying.

[Azilius]

I argue like a seven year old

I can do that too.

[Fiction]

I argue like a seven year old

I can do that too.

Yeah, I noticed he was putting words in your mouth. Kinda funny though, he's the one saying we're to blame for people dying, yet he's the only one that wishes death on innocent people.

[penfold1992]

I argue like a seven year old

I can do that too.

Yeah, I noticed he was putting words in your mouth. Kinda funny though, he's the one saying we're to blame for people dying, yet he's the only one that wishes death on innocent people.

allowing easy access to guns is the same thing. need to have millions more guns in america to stop gun crime.... merican logic.

i may wish death but my country isnt causing it. you dont wish it but your country is doing it.

but i believe in survival of the fittest so u carry on killing yourselfs.

[Fiction]

Really don't think you're in any position to be criticizing another's logic. Also, the theory of survival of the fittest is contradictory of what you've been spewing. To sum it up, your post made no sense at all. Why are you here? lol I wish we could write this off as trolling...

[Azilius]

allowing easy access to guns is the same thing. need to have millions more guns in america to stop gun crime

Wishing death on innocent people != allowing easy access to guns.

.... merican logic.

Generalization? Racism? Narrow mindedness?

i may wish death but my country isnt causing it. you dont wish it but your country is doing it.

You wishing death and your country not causing it are not linked at all. They are mutually exclusive. Neither of the above sentences have any merit or sense. They are garbage.

but i believe in survival of the fittest so u carry on killing yourselfs.

The amendment to bear arms is in place on the logic of survival of the fittest.

[penfold1992]

if someone dies, it doesnt matter. unless its a close relative.
this thread can be written off but people are still dieing for no reason due to the ignorance and arrogance of the american population that have similar opinions to those here.

california have already tried something that I suggested.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/27/us/ca ... .html?_r=0

my ideas were "stupid" though.... still implemented.

[Azilius]

if someone dies, it doesnt matter. unless its a close relative.

Opinion, not fact.

this thread can be written off but people are still dieing for no reason due to the ignorance and arrogance of the american population that have similar opinions to those here.

You've said this on every page of this thread but still have yet to refute our points in a logical and reasonable manner. Present us with a proper argument and maybe you'll show us something we didn't consider. It is, however, unlikely since gun laws are there for a reason along with the rest of the amendments.

california have already tried something that I suggested.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/27/us/ca ... .html?_r=0

my ideas were "stupid" though.... still implemented.

An optional buyback program. Sounds like what you were talking about.

[Fiction]

california have already tried something that I suggested.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/27/us/ca ... .html?_r=0

my ideas were "stupid" though.... still implemented.

Haha, citing a law California has implemented doesn't help your case. If I had a dime for every stupid law that California manages to crank out, I'd be a millionaire.

Azilius rips your post apart, and shows your ignorance, yet your reply to his post begins and ends with that exact same ignorance he just exposed. You lack the ability to learn...

[heroo]

The government should have the monopoly on the possession of guns. Just pray to God your government keeps order.

But one thing I do find funny. You guys think the law to have a weapon is more important than the law to have a healthinsurance. Sometimes I really don't understand American society, but I guess it's a cultural thing.

[penfold1992]

if america had 1% of the guns it does now, are you trying to tell me it wouldnt reduce the death count due to gun crime?
the fact that california is trying to reduce the number of guns is apparently a stupid idea now?

i dont think i lack the ability to learn, i think its the american law that lacks the ability to learn. when the right to bear arms was wrote, there was less then 1% of the guns in america now and it was in times when black people were still considered property. Also guns werent as advanced as they are today.

if people in california are willing to give up some guns it shouldnt be any different anywhere else in america. Maybe they wont get rid of 50% of the guns but something is better then doing nothing (although apparently nothing is just as good)

people dieing is a good indication that someone needs to learn something. Im not part of that population but you are.

[Baconz]

Please, end all of this.

oh shush.. I'm quite enjoying this

[Rawr]

Please, end all of this.

oh shush.. I'm quite enjoying this

Indeed, penfold and vegeta are the only reasons I bother coming to this forum anymore..

[penfold1992]

Please, end all of this.

oh shush.. I'm quite enjoying this

Indeed, penfold and vegeta are the only reasons I bother coming to this forum anymore..

im glad you come here. regardless if you like me or not were still glad you are part of the community =)

[Ger_slayer]

The government should have the monopoly on the possession of guns. Just pray to God your government keeps order.

But one thing I do find funny. You guys think the law to have a weapon is more important than the law to have a health insurance. Sometimes I really don't understand American society, but I guess it's a cultural thing.

That.

[Blindfire]

• Require firearms license renewal every 3 years.
• Require the same procedure for renewal as the initial application for the license (background check, psychiatric evaluation).
• Ban the storage of firearms in homes with mentally unstable people.
• Require a firearms license to purchase firearms at expositions.

If people don't want to comply with the procedures they must surrender their guns to their local PD.

Obviously it isn't fail safe but it would go a long way in preventing firearms ending up in the wrong hands. Banning high capacity magazines and assault rifles isn't going to stop mass shootings. The largest massacre on American soil (Virginia Tech) was done with two pistols.

[penfold1992]

its about reducing the chance of these things happening. you are not going to stop people who are all out intent on creating extreme terror so instead make it harder for them but also make it difficult for people to think that way anyway.
I would guess that 80% of the shootings that occur now would not have happened if a gun wasnt so readily available to people