Rogue + Warlock

[Charatsandhu]

Please post your opinions about this build if it were lv 90-100 FF . what would the pro's and con's be? how would it face againt otehr builds in PVP?

[Tig3ress]

rapeage.

That sums it up

[Intentions]

if they dont use special pills then its game over
just control them (slumber ,daze, etc) and prick+ combo if needed
that would drop anyone around your same lvl and higher
if that doesnt work you can do the same thing then debuff then rape

the only reason there arent alot of rogue/warlocks is because rogues have amazing dmg already so its not that necessary

[JKMB]

Rogue/warlock is overkill, rogues rely a lot on their sub, more so then warriors for example, if they have pills or holyword, and most of the time they do, then your dead.

[LillDev!l]

They sure are overkill, its plain annoying if you ask me
They dont really have "nice" pvp's though, they just 1 hit anything.
A level 83 warlock/rogue with +3 daggers and ... "decent" gear crit 48k on me, this is me : http://www.rev6.com/player.asp?id=488776 see for yourself how fair that is xD
The only problem is when people use teh pill bug and spam pills or have holy word i guess ^^
If sleep fails, your pretty much dead aswell coz i crit around 25k on avarage on a rogue off my level with DD on

[Pan_Raider(`_´)]

well, you can still put bleed /decay on them

[raphaell666]

I believe it's a good build. This build would pretty much own chinese characters in 1vs1 (unless they get lucky and resist your debuffs and/or have pills), and it would have 'problems' against people with holy spell/word on.

[willieb3]

Iwas going to try this build but i figured it would take to much sp and would get pwned in pvp

[raphaell666]

Iwas going to try this build but i figured it would take to much sp and would get pwned in pvp

I'm pretty sure that this build will hardly ever get "pwned in pvp" if you actually know how to use it.

[Charatsandhu]

@ JKMB , if my warlock debuffs are lvl 90 max, i believe that they have a stronger effect than what holy word can resist. im not entirely sure, but if anyone could confirm this for me, that would be awesome.

@ LillDev!l , what pill bug are you talking about? im not familiar with it. Also, if sleep doesn not work, there is always stun and the KB with xbow.

The only enemy i see of this build is someone that uses special pills. Also, warlocks are annoying in pvp, and i will be able to kill botters with sun sets with debuffs + DD or EC

[raphaell666]

if my warlock debuffs are lvl 90 max, i believe that they have a stronger effect than what holy word can resist. im not entirely sure, but if anyone could confirm this for me, that would be awesome.

At cap holy spell/word makes you immune to all debuffs (except for the "especial" ones).

[JKMB]

@ JKMB , if my warlock debuffs are lvl 90 max, i believe that they have a stronger effect than what holy word can resist. im not entirely sure, but if anyone could confirm this for me, that would be awesome.

Check sig you would be better off taking warrior instead of rogue, or taking cleric or bard instead of warlock. Its a decent build but it lacks defence and it is unbalanced, your slow, you die fast and in group situations you will get your ass handed to you. Its a good build for cape heroes though.

[Ningyotsukai-san]

Its a decent build but it lacks defence and it is unbalanced, your slow, you die fast and in group situations you will get your ass handed to you.

Slow, yes.

Dies fast, not really.

Ass handed to you in group situations, depends on the "situation".

if my warlock debuffs are lvl 90 max, i believe that they have a stronger effect than what holy word can resist. im not entirely sure, but if anyone could confirm this for me, that would be awesome.

Only Disease (Vampire Kiss), Bleed (Decay), and Panic (Wheel Bind) go through Holy Spell (that I've confirmed myself). Some people say that Death Trap goes through, but I'm not certain.

[JKMB]

Its a decent build but it lacks defence and it is unbalanced, your slow, you die fast and in group situations you will get your ass handed to you.

Slow, yes.

Dies fast, not really.

Ass handed to you in group situations, depends on the "situation

lol? your joking right? Rogue has about as much defence as a paper bag, and your warlock debuffs are so costly that you cant rely on spam hp leeching like clerics can with their heals, in group pvp your gimped since you can only really incapacitate one person at a time, if you play the build correctly and have some luck its possible to trap/sleep up to 3 ppl and then deal with them 1 by 1, but good luck with that really. The build is good in 1v1 and in eliminating important targets, for example taking out FW commanders or traders, dont expect it to perform well on the front line of combat however.

[Ningyotsukai-san]

In group pvp you're gimped since you can only really incapacitate one person at a time, if you play the build correctly and have some luck its possible to trap/sleep up to 3 ppl and then deal with them 1 by 1. Dont expect it to perform well on the front line of combat however.

The way you set that up, it sounds more like a handicap match than a group pvp. Yea, you can incapacitate 1 person at a time, but that's the good thing about "group" pvp...you're not the only one to go about killing people.

Stun / bleed / panic 'em and let the other damage dealers kill 'em. If people are on some of the damage dealers, just use scorn. (I used "depends on the situation" for a reason...can give certain examples but that's not always the case...some you're at an advantage, others you're in the can; pros & cons of a build).

And of course, the "front lines" isn't exactly for this build. It is a rogue afterall. It'd be foolish to think you'd tank just as good as a warrior.

As long as you don't DD / EX all the time, and have a cleric, you won't die as easily (using grains help a lot, too).

[Charatsandhu]

I understand where u guys are coming from on the entire group thing, but i think as long as i stay back and let the warriors/glaivers run upfront and tank, i should be OK in FW's and trade runs etc. , if i do my debuffs from behind and take them out with xbow, and it would be smart to have warriors and cleric in party =) ( bless, screens, damage absorb)

(stealth would have been a good tactic, but everyone has pk2 edit these days >.< )

@ decay - if decay maxed at 90 can go through holy word, isn't that good then? since it reduces physical defense, if i can decay them and either stun/sleep/knockback(xbow), and use extreme crossbow and a quick hurricane shot, followed by another attack should be enough to take anyone down.

if anyone thinks otherwise, please post your opinion, i want to explore all variables before i dedicate myself to this build ^_^

[Intentions]

for this build i see 1v1 being its strong point
and thats really about it
any other sub would be better and less sp costly

[JKMB]

In group pvp you're gimped since you can only really incapacitate one person at a time, if you play the build correctly and have some luck its possible to trap/sleep up to 3 ppl and then deal with them 1 by 1. Dont expect it to perform well on the front line of combat however.

The way you set that up, it sounds more like a handicap match than a group pvp. Yea, you can incapacitate 1 person at a time, but that's the good thing about "group" pvp...you're not the only one to go about killing people.

Stun / bleed / panic 'em and let the other damage dealers kill 'em. If people are on some of the damage dealers, just use scorn. (I used "depends on the situation" for a reason...can give certain examples but that's not always the case...some you're at an advantage, others you're in the can; pros & cons of a build).

And of course, the "front lines" isn't exactly for this build. It is a rogue afterall. It'd be foolish to think you'd tank just as good as a warrior.

As long as you don't DD / EX all the time, and have a cleric, you won't die as easily (using grains help a lot, too).

Im not saying its a shit build (hell I was the strongest character on Zeus during the 80cap) but it honestly is not practical in group fights where it could be better replaced with an int warlock, and you sure as hell need those grains because without vig's/mp grains you will defiantly run out of mp after about 5 debuffs, trap, sleep and a bleed dot.

for this build i see 1v1 being its strong point
and thats really about it
any other sub would be better and less sp costly

This sums it up, ultimate cape hero build, warrior is a better formate to take warlock sub because unlike a rogue your not farked if someone can make your sub redundant.
Unless your running back to the safe zone or can rely on constant warrior support (and most warriors outside of Venus dont even have the frenzy line skilled) then you will die because your a bullet magnet, the warlock is almost always the 2nd highest priority target after the cleric.

[raphaell666]

@ decay - if decay maxed at 90 can go through holy word, isn't that good then? since it reduces physical defense, if i can decay them and either stun/sleep/knockback(xbow), and use extreme crossbow and a quick hurricane shot, followed by another attack should be enough to take anyone down.

Decay cannot surpass holy word/spell when at cap (if holy spell/word is maxed). The only ones that I recall right now that surpass holy word/spell are stun, panic and bleed.

Intentions wrote:
for this build i see 1v1 being its strong point
and thats really about it
any other sub would be better and less sp costly

This sums it up, ultimate cape hero build, warrior is a better formate to take warlock sub because unlike a rogue your not farked if someone can make your sub redundant.
Unless your running back to the safe zone or can rely on constant warrior support (and most warriors outside of Venus dont even have the frenzy line skilled) then you will die because your a bullet magnet, the warlock is almost always the 2nd highest priority target after the cleric.

+1 I completely agree with both.

[Charatsandhu]

SP is not a problem for me

but, most of you have said that it is a pwnage build for 1 on 1 pvp, and thats about the only thing that happens on Poseidon server ^_^


only "group pvp" that happens is fortress wars, no one likes to guild war, go on trade runs, or anything >.<

off-topic - whenever u interfere in 1 on 1 pvp, they consider it "disrespectful" and everyone jumps you, so i use m friend 62 rogue to gross scorn everyone and mess up pvps, its really funny to watch ^_^

[raphaell666]

off-topic - whenever u interfere in 1 on 1 pvp, they consider it "disrespectful" and everyone jumps you, so i use m friend 62 rogue to gross scorn everyone and mess up pvps, its really funny to watch ^_^

I guess you'd like if that happened to you when you are seriously 1vs1 pvping someone.