Barotix wrote:No one (afaik) doubts the existence of Abraham. He was a Sumerian that rebelled against his father's house. What they doubt is the existence of a Deity or g(G)od. I like to keep it simple:
If it's supernatural then it's not real.
Barotix, Atheists didn't like the idea of creation coming into being instantly. They named the idea proposed by their opponents the "Big Bang" but never thought the term would catch on. It was a derogatory term. They hated anything that implied creation and resisted any and all theories based on that belief.
From a cosmological point of view it is ironic that the examination of physical, observable evidence brings mankind to again search for the unobservable. Is "dark matter" or "dark energy" natural? Hardly. Non-baryonic, non-electromagnetic stuff is hardly "natural". It strikes me as strange that those who believe so desperately in "nature" have nothing left to do but look outside for any answer to their existence.
There was a time when not too long ago the universe was thought to be in an eternal state of expansion and contraction cycles. That "answer" to the dilemma didn't last long. There is no way to understand the only other alternative to creation. Can you give me one example (other than the Big Bang) where something came from nothing?
We know the universe is expanding. That means that it was smaller a thousand years ago. Smaller still the further back in time you go. According to current theory, if we go back all the way in time to the point of origin we arrive at the moment of the BANG. What before? God is eternal, He is outside of our understanding. Outside of time and space. Abraham believed God and became the father of many nations. That was nature. Observable nature. His children were taught about his experiences. If you would wish to make him, and his children liars and deceivers, so be it.
But don't call it natural. The stars were put in the heavens by God for seasons and times and for signs. Signs portray meaning. Nature itself speaks of God.
~Grandpa
