Chinese Hybrids & You.

[RogueKiller]

easly, any wizard with cleric as sub can easily survive the whole 5 combo books of a glavier (this is if were talking max lvl cause that is when a glavier, bower or blader would have the most hp). But I guess pulling the cleric card wouldn't be the same as the mana shield card, that one spear book with the red animation and castle shield card, so no there is no wiz that can survive a one hit.

A glaiver shouldn't be using the 5 combo ever for pvp. Theyre time consuming and dont do much damage. If the combos are what the glaivers are hitting with, then yes the Wizard will always win. No doubt about that.

Hybrid is a better build altogether for chinese (allow me to explain.)

Alright, according to that nifty character builder... a pure int at lv 90 w/ perfect gear would have:

9846 HP
+25403 MP
+1800 on head/chest/legs

= 37,049 HP/MP combined

now a hybrid, with just -10int and +10more str, also w/ perfect gear:

10429 HP
+24821 MP
+1800 on head/chest/legs

= 37,050 HP/MP combined

need I remind you 37,050 > 37,049: therefore, Hybrid is OBVIOUSLY the SUPERIOR build

</mild_sarcasm>

Hybrid doesnt really work too well with euros because of only one kind of damage on their weapons. But on chinese characters... wouldnt the ideal hybrid build be proportional to the mag and phy damage of your weapon? Like, say a spear, in general, is 2 mag damage : 1 phy damage, wouldnt the ideal hybrid for a spear be 2:1? And then have heuksal mastery with a nuking mastery to max your (combined) mag&phy damage.

(really, at this point, I think im just rambling)

Actually by that logic all your proving is that a Force glaiver is the best all around build.
Considering they have:
Hp:31k (Rounded)
Mp:14k (Rounded)
45,000 Hp/Mp combined.

[selenne]

one thing: the cap of masteries will never be increased? cuz euros can always hav 2 masteries fully farmed, but theyre euros. chineses would suck with only 2 masteries.

[Da_Realest]

Any playstyle that depends on alchemy to do well isn't a good one. Here are some hybrid builds before there was alchemy. Yea they're using ice imbue but you'd be surprised how many people aren't immune to ice today. Also, of course their gear isn't equal but its much closer compared to how things are now.

Spoiler!

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Overall, hybrids and pures are very similar. The DPS may be higher in one build, one may crit higher, one may be able to tank longer, etc. but overall the strengths of one build do not clearly outweigh the weaknesses of one build. That could change depending on the type of skills JM add later. Also, because Chinese weapons do both types of damage, it doesn't matter where you put stat points as long as you're using imbue and/or str skills. In the end, it will always come down to who gets the most crits, stuns, blocks, knockdowns, etc. Anyone who says hybrid or pure is better because they win all the time or most of the time, that means nothing. Gear and luck is a big factor.

Once JM implemented the alchemy update, the game became less about skill and anyone that had a playstyle that heavily depended on the ice tree needed to rethink their playstyle. Many of the ice skills are useless against some people in PvP now. Any build can beat another build with luck if they are wearing nearly the same gear.

[John_Doe]

easly, any wizard with cleric as sub can easily survive the whole 5 combo books of a glavier (this is if were talking max lvl cause that is when a glavier, bower or blader would have the most hp). But I guess pulling the cleric card wouldn't be the same as the mana shield card, that one spear book with the red animation and castle shield card, so no there is no wiz that can survive a one hit.

A glaiver shouldn't be using the 5 combo ever for pvp. Theyre time consuming and dont do much damage. If the combos are what the glaivers are hitting with, then yes the Wizard will always win. No doubt about that.[/quote]

must be a horrible glavier to not be able to kill a wizard with the faster combo, not like spamming stun and spin would do any difference if i were too pull the cleric card.

[F-22]

No. A pure int will hit higher with weapon skills, because his mag balance is higher. The point of a hybrid int is to not get 2-3 skilled after snow shield from a glavier. At higher caps a hybrid won't work, because you will have 2 masteries only, so it would be heuskal 150 and light 150, or light 150 and cold 150, but every hybrid sucks without a weapon mastery...

???? hybrid does less damage with weapon skills? you got to be crazy, there is a ratio for hybrid int to become effecient when using weapon skills. If youre too hybrid you will be like blader, if close to pure int you will hit less damage but hit harder with nukes. So you have to choose the correct ratio(i wont tell you what it is because it is a secret).

BTW what lvl are you? and how long have you been playing this game?

[JesusLOL]

No. A pure int will hit higher with weapon skills, because his mag balance is higher. The point of a hybrid int is to not get 2-3 skilled after snow shield from a glavier. At higher caps a hybrid won't work, because you will have 2 masteries only, so it would be heuskal 150 and light 150, or light 150 and cold 150, but every hybrid sucks without a weapon mastery...

???? hybrid does less damage with weapon skills? you got to be crazy, there is a ratio for hybrid int to become effecient when using weapon skills. If youre too hybrid you will be like blader, if close to pure int you will hit less damage but hit harder with nukes. So you have to choose the correct ratio(i wont tell you what it is because it is a secret).

BTW what lvl are you? and how long have you been playing this game?

yes. hybrid does less damage with weapon skills, the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with imbue + weapon skills is(I seen jesus last night, but dont tell anyone, keep it as secret)

I'm lvl 90 full farmed spear hybrid, and playing since beta, and if you don't know yet, that a pure int will do everytime more dmg with weapon skills then I'm sorry for you. As soon as you use imbue, your phy balance doesn't matter anymore, because imbue = mag based, so the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with the weapon skills.

[Rained]

one thing: the cap of masteries will never be increased? cuz euros can always hav 2 masteries fully farmed, but theyre euros. chineses would suck with only 2 masteries.

Looking into Ksro and Csro with lvl 100 cap but 300 mastery still, you may have your answer now. Even if it would raise, wont be in near future too.

[F-22]

No. A pure int will hit higher with weapon skills, because his mag balance is higher. The point of a hybrid int is to not get 2-3 skilled after snow shield from a glavier. At higher caps a hybrid won't work, because you will have 2 masteries only, so it would be heuskal 150 and light 150, or light 150 and cold 150, but every hybrid sucks without a weapon mastery...

???? hybrid does less damage with weapon skills? you got to be crazy, there is a ratio for hybrid int to become effecient when using weapon skills. If youre too hybrid you will be like blader, if close to pure int you will hit less damage but hit harder with nukes. So you have to choose the correct ratio(i wont tell you what it is because it is a secret).

BTW what lvl are you? and how long have you been playing this game?

yes. hybrid does less damage with weapon skills, the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with imbue + weapon skills is(I seen jesus last night, but dont tell anyone, keep it as secret)

I'm lvl 90 full farmed spear hybrid, and playing since beta, and if you don't know yet, that a pure int will do everytime more dmg with weapon skills then I'm sorry for you. As soon as you use imbue, your phy balance doesn't matter anymore, because imbue = mag based, so the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with the weapon skills.

sorry to say you are wrong, pure int nukes more damage but when using weapon skills hybrid hit hardest unless pure str crit.

BTW, what kinda of hybrid are you? ratio?

[JesusLOL]

???? hybrid does less damage with weapon skills? you got to be crazy, there is a ratio for hybrid int to become effecient when using weapon skills. If youre too hybrid you will be like blader, if close to pure int you will hit less damage but hit harder with nukes. So you have to choose the correct ratio(i wont tell you what it is because it is a secret).

BTW what lvl are you? and how long have you been playing this game?

yes. hybrid does less damage with weapon skills, the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with imbue + weapon skills is(I seen jesus last night, but dont tell anyone, keep it as secret)

I'm lvl 90 full farmed spear hybrid, and playing since beta, and if you don't know yet, that a pure int will do everytime more dmg with weapon skills then I'm sorry for you. As soon as you use imbue, your phy balance doesn't matter anymore, because imbue = mag based, so the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with the weapon skills.

sorry to say you are wrong, pure int nukes more damage but when using weapon skills hybrid hit hardest unless pure str crit.

BTW, what kinda of hybrid are you? ratio?

Well you can ask anyone else, I explained you why a pure int will do more damage with weapon skills, but you didn't explain me why a hybrid should do more dmg with weapon skills? My ratio is 4:1 I think, around 19k hp and almost 25k mp. Well wait for someone else to confrim what I said already, the phy balance doesnt matter when you use imbue, the higher your mag balance the higher your dmg with imbue, nukes or weaponskills doesn't matter.

[F-22]

???? hybrid does less damage with weapon skills? you got to be crazy, there is a ratio for hybrid int to become effecient when using weapon skills. If youre too hybrid you will be like blader, if close to pure int you will hit less damage but hit harder with nukes. So you have to choose the correct ratio(i wont tell you what it is because it is a secret).

BTW what lvl are you? and how long have you been playing this game?

yes. hybrid does less damage with weapon skills, the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with imbue + weapon skills is(I seen jesus last night, but dont tell anyone, keep it as secret)

I'm lvl 90 full farmed spear hybrid, and playing since beta, and if you don't know yet, that a pure int will do everytime more dmg with weapon skills then I'm sorry for you. As soon as you use imbue, your phy balance doesn't matter anymore, because imbue = mag based, so the higher your mag balance, the higher your damage with the weapon skills.

sorry to say you are wrong, pure int nukes more damage but when using weapon skills hybrid hit hardest unless pure str crit.

BTW, what kinda of hybrid are you? ratio?

Well you can ask anyone else, I explained you why a pure int will do more damage with weapon skills, but you didn't explain me why a hybrid should do more dmg with weapon skills? My ratio is 4:1 I think, around 19k hp and almost 25k mp. Well wait for someone else to confrim what I said already, the phy balance doesnt matter when you use imbue, the higher your mag balance the higher your dmg with imbue, nukes or weaponskills doesn't matter.

eheheh, i forgot that part. You did mention a point why pure int do more dammage than hybrid but you forgot about one thing. Which the weapon skills, weapon skills are phy damage so you also need high phy balance to get the most out of it, since hybrid have good mag% combine with ok phy balance they will out damage pure int weapon attacks. phy and mag balance are important becuase they dictate the out come of the damage. You can always test it out yourself. You are the first hybrid i know that said pure int can out damage a hybrid int using weapon skills. That is why hybrids more speacial than any other builds because they can out damage the opponent with their weapon skils. We can always ask people on here for there comments on the outcome of hte damage between a pure int and hybrid int. youre a 1:4 which is a good ratio, you will be able to outdamage a pure int using your spear skills.

[NuclearSilo]

Hybrid hits harder, pure str hits weaker, pure int hits hardest, etc... All of this are bullshits. All depends on what kind of enemy you are fighting with.
Enemy with high mag defense? Enemy with high phy defense? Enemy with moderate defense?
A hybrid str hits harder than pure str against pure str in armor, protector (Ex: warrior) because they have low mag defense.
A hybrid str hits weaker than pure str against pure int in garment, protector (Ex: pure int garment & shield) because their mag defense is extremly high that the bonus mag dmg you added to Int is not enough to overtake the defense.
Same story with pure int who hits a pure str in armor... and a hybrid int... the dmg added to Str is not enough to overtake the physical defense.

Well wait for someone else to confrim what I said already, the phy balance doesnt matter when you use imbue, the higher your mag balance the higher your dmg with imbue, nukes or weaponskills doesn't matter.

Phy and mag dmg are calculated seperately, it's not because you use imbue that you can ignore your physical power. Saying that is like saying a pure str who uses weapon skill lvl 60 + imbue lvl 80 deal the same dmg as a a pure str who uses weapon skill lvl 80 + imbue lvl 80 because they use the same imbue and has the same magical balance...
Again, read the paragraph above, it's not because you have higher mag balance that you always deal more dmg.

[F-22]

Hybrid hits harder, pure str hits weaker, pure int hits hardest, etc... All of this are bullshits. All depends on what kind of enemy you are fighting with.
Enemy with high mag defense? Enemy with high phy defense? Enemy with moderate defense?
A hybrid str hits harder than pure str against pure str in armor, protector (Ex: warrior) because they have low mag defense.
A hybrid str hits weaker than pure str against pure int in garment, protector (Ex: pure int garment & shield) because their mag defense is extremly high that the bonus mag dmg you added to Int is not enough to overtake the defense.
Same story with pure int who hits a pure str in armor... and a hybrid int... the dmg added to Str is not enough to overtake the physical defense.

Well wait for someone else to confrim what I said already, the phy balance doesnt matter when you use imbue, the higher your mag balance the higher your dmg with imbue, nukes or weaponskills doesn't matter.

Phy and mag dmg are calculated seperately, it's not because you use imbue that you can ignore your physical power. Saying that is like saying a pure str who uses weapon skill lvl 60 + imbue lvl 80 deal the same dmg as a a pure str who uses weapon skill lvl 80 + imbue lvl 80 because they use the same imbue and has the same magical balance...
Again, read the paragraph above, it's not because you have higher mag balance that you always deal more dmg.

youre my hero!!!!! i agree what you said, the damage outcome depends on a lot of things and who you are fighting against is important too.

[JesusLOL]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

[F-22]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

using your spear skill? or nukes? if nukes of course he will out damage you.

[NuclearSilo]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

INT or STR doesnt escape the rule of the game: the dmg formula is universal. It's not because u added more INT than STR to your character that the game decide to calculate the dmg differently. Phy and mag dmg part are calculated seperately.
The reason you deal less dmg than your friend it's not because he has more mag balance than you; but because the stat points you added to STR to hybridizing your char dont let you gain enough phy balance and phy dmg to overtake the enemy's physical defense.

[F-22]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

INT or STR doesnt escape the rule of the game: the dmg formula is universal. It's not because u added more INT than STR to your character that the game decide to calculate the dmg differently. Phy and mag dmg part are calculated seperately.
The reason you deal less dmg than your friend it's not because he has more mag balance than you; but because the stat points you added to STR to hybridizing your char dont let you gain enough phy balance and phy dmg to overtake the enemy's physical defense.

ahahaha nice word "hybridizing"

[NuclearSilo]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

INT or STR doesnt escape the rule of the game: the dmg formula is universal. It's not because u added more INT than STR to your character that the game decide to calculate the dmg differently. Phy and mag dmg part are calculated seperately.
The reason you deal less dmg than your friend it's not because he has more mag balance than you; but because the stat points you added to STR to hybridizing your char dont let you gain enough phy balance and phy dmg to overtake the enemy's physical defense.

ahahaha nice word "hybridizing"

Is that word english?

[F-22]

Is that word english?

its americanese

[JesusLOL]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

INT or STR doesnt escape the rule of the game: the dmg formula is universal. It's not because u added more INT than STR to your character that the game decide to calculate the dmg differently. Phy and mag dmg part are calculated seperately.
The reason you deal less dmg than your friend it's not because he has more mag balance than you; but because the stat points you added to STR to hybridizing your char dont let you gain enough phy balance and phy dmg to overtake the enemy's physical defense.

hm? We tested it on a mangyang, and his mars dmg was EVERYTIME higher for ~1k, and my phy balance is higher than his. And a pure int did more damage than him with mars, why that? Because his mag balance was higher. So we come to the conclusion if the mag balance is higher, the int does more damage with weapon skills, or why do int do more dmg than str with weapon skills? even if str got super high phy balance.

[NuclearSilo]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars. Ofcouse it will be different on STR chars. If anyone has a 90 full farmed spear hybrid char, with same masteries like mine and higher mag balance, you will see that he gonna do more damage than me. I've tested it with my friend, he has 109% mag balance, and he did more damage than me on the same enemy.

INT or STR doesnt escape the rule of the game: the dmg formula is universal. It's not because u added more INT than STR to your character that the game decide to calculate the dmg differently. Phy and mag dmg part are calculated seperately.
The reason you deal less dmg than your friend it's not because he has more mag balance than you; but because the stat points you added to STR to hybridizing your char dont let you gain enough phy balance and phy dmg to overtake the enemy's physical defense.

hm? We tested it on a mangyang, and his mars dmg was EVERYTIME higher for ~1k, and my phy balance is higher than his. And a pure int did more damage than him with mars, why that? Because his mag balance was higher. So we come to the conclusion if the mag balance is higher, the int does more damage with weapon skills, or why do int do more dmg than str with weapon skills? even if str got super high phy balance.

Yes, but having higher mag balance is just 1/2 of the reason, you didnt see the main reason behind it.

1% of magic power > 1% of physic power so obviously if u lose 10% of magic to win 10% of physic power, you'll be weaker than a pure. Mangyang has low physical defense, and both of you have higher physical power than his defense, therefore your test means nothing. Try to test with the enemy with less phy def than your phy power, but higher than your friend's phy power. Very simple, ask out a pure int in garment uses bloody fan storm + 600 mag def, and +1000 mag buff screen from warrior; u'll see that the pure int dmg is reduce to the minimal, while a hybrid 70:70 has his dmg reduce only 50%, the phy dmg remain the same and the overall dmg is higher than the pure int.

So what im trying to tell you is that it's not just the mag balance that count in dmg, but also the enemy's defense.

Int always deal more dmg than a pure str because 1% of magic > 1% of physic. And if you notice, your weapon always has mag power > phy power.

[Nitro]

Youre my hero!!!!! i agree what you said, the damage outcome depends on a lot of things and who you are fighting against is important too.

We all love Nuclear Btw are those two girls the same from your Sigs/Avy?
Offtopic , CBA to read what you are discussing

[JesusLOL]

@Nuclear

It's a bit confusing, but I'll reply when I get time to fully re-read the Thread.


I think the chicks are the same, nothing better than asian chicks. I forgot the name tho, so nuclear post the name(s).

[TheDrop]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars.

well from wat u said, a lvl 80 Int using lvl 19 Ghost Spear + lvl 80 Imbue will do the same dmg as a lvl 80 Int using the last book of Ghost Spear + Lvl 80 imbue.

btw nicely put NuclearSilo

[JesusLOL]

Read what I said. We are talking about INT, not any STR Chars. Don't make any examples on STR chars, because the discussion is about INT chars.

well from wat u said, a lvl 80 Int using lvl 19 Ghost Spear + lvl 80 Imbue will do the same dmg as a lvl 80 Int using the last book of Ghost Spear + Lvl 80 imbue.

btw nicely put NuclearSilo

Your post doesn't make sense, I never said that. I said that the pure int will still outdamage the hybrid int with weapon skills, because imbue is mag based, so the higher the mag balance, the higher the damage. I'll post later few screens if I get time, and I need to re-read his posts first.

[F-22]

her name is crystal liu yi fei. she is in the movie Forbidden Kingdom. we both worship the same girl.

[PB_and_J]

the most simple damage formula: (attack% * phy ballance) + (imbue% * magical ballance)

Str: (280% mars * 97) + (100% imbue * 37)

tell me. raiseing the 37 and lowering the 97 will make ur damage go up?
if anyone says yes. ill give them a cookie. i got 2 cookies. u can have 1. then we will both end up with 4 cookies each math ftl

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=56392&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=hybrid+pure&start=90

[JesusLOL]

So basically Fly is saying, the higher your phy balance, the more damage you do with weapon skills, right?

"the pure will hit 5k. the hybrid will hit 4k. the pure will crit for 10k. the hybrid will crit for 6.5k." That's correct for str vs str I think, but not for int vs int.


Why are people with higher mag balance than myself out damaging me? Even If i got higher phy balance than them, tested on many mobs/chars.

Also you forgot to check the last pages of the thread.

The dmg formula is wrong, the right is this : [(phy power + weap skill power)*phy bal. + (mag power + imbue power)*mag bal.]*multiplier

Therefore the dmg of pure str: [(phy power + mars power)*97% + (mag power + imbue power)*28%]*(280%+100%)

And dmg of a hybrid, 1:1 for ex: [(phy power + mars power)*75% + (mag power + imbue power)*62%]*(280%+100%)

If u notice, hybrid has 12% more balances. Also u made me shocked because u dont know why adding int will give more dmg . Because for any weapon, mag power > phy power. So if u lower 10 phy dmg, u'll gain 10X mag dmg. Where X is the ratio mag/phy.

Blade/Glaive: mag = 1.4*phy
Sword/Spear: mag = 1.8*phy
Bow: mag = 1.6*phy

We are talking about glaiver. So losing 10 phy dmg in exchange of 14 mag dmg. And also, 1% phy balance in exchange of 1.4% mag balance.

Replacing mag = 1.4*phy in the formulas above, we have :
Pure str: (phy*136.2% + mars*97% + imbue*28%)*(280%+100%)
Hybrid 1:1: (phy*161.8% + mars*75% + imbue*62%)*(280%+100%)

And the difference:
Hybrid 1:1 - pure str = (25.6%phy - 22%mars +34%imbue)*2.8
Assuming mars~imbue, and if the cap is 70, u use weapon lvl 68 and skill lvl 69, mars = 0.69*phy.
And the real difference of dmg is : 93.85%phy

Almost the double

***Note***: As i explained in a post, defense involves. Mag balance should be at least 45%-66% to be effective. Otherwise, adding int is a waste ie str hybrid.

[kthnxbai]

Anybody with life wouldnt read this thread QQ
sowwy

[JesusLOL]

Anybody with life wouldnt read this thread QQ
sowwy

very intelligent comment, represents your IQ which is equal to -1. Also the "no life" thing is so old, and people are still using it? If you don't have anything informative to post here that could help people in this thread, then don't post at all.

[Burningwolf]

Anybody with life wouldnt read this thread QQ
sowwy

very intelligent comment, represents your IQ which is equal to -1. Also the "no life" thing is so old, and people are still using it? If you don't have anything informative to post here that could help people in this thread, then don't post at all.

u sir failed with that insult =/
and only ppl who are lame will get offended
why the hell will you dedicate so much time into find which is better?
just choose the one you like ffs