Bard/....?

[Mefra]

Hey guys, started a very similar topic last week, but not a lot of respons. Anyway, I was thinking about creating a bard. Now I'd like to add cleric to it, just for the sake of fortress wars etc. with my guild, but I wonder if you'll ever use Bard and Cleric together. If you're only gonna use the Bard, I might as well take wizard. But then the character will be very weak and will be dying the most of all the characters.

(by the way, Wizard/Cleric ain't an option...it has to conclude Bard)

[noobert mclagg]

Cleric seems like it would be the best sub for all around support. Most of the time in paties/fortress war u will be using cleric though, but bard is still very use full for the buffs, dances, and mp heals. Bard does more damage and the skills cast pretty much instantly, so u will prolly use bard when u are soloing.

[Mefra]

Cleric seems like it would be the best sub for all around support. Most of the time in paties/fortress war u will be using cleric though, but bard is still very use full for the buffs, dances, and mp heals. Bard does more damage and the skills cast pretty much instantly, so u will prolly use bard when u are soloing.

Already had this part covered. Would only take bard and the usefull skills from cleric. Then around 50 I would start 9 gapping and go along with guild members

Are there a lot spells from bard that stay on party members after you switch your weapon. I know cleric has a few (although you'll loose it yourself).

[Mefra]

Hey guys....it's been a while since someone posted something here...

So Bard/Cleric for full support or Bard/Wizard, so I can use Bard for support (I'm only gonna do this if I won't be much of a use when I'm using both and end up using only Cleric...)

[noobert mclagg]

Bard/cleric both cleric and bard are very useful in parties, bard heals mana, speed increase, noise, and buff with turbours (dont know how u spell it) cleric will heal hp, res, and buff. So u will be using both in a party.

[Nitro]

Cleric seems like it would be the best sub for all around support. Most of the time in paties/fortress war u will be using cleric though, but bard is still very use full for the buffs, dances, and mp heals. Bard does more damage and the skills cast pretty much instantly, so u will prolly use bard when u are soloing.

+1 ... go cleric ...

[AngelEyes]

I have had a few experiences playing with Bard/Clerics in my parties, gotta tell ya, not a big fan. The tanks all wanted him to heal and the Wiz all wanted MP. All the people I played with were not that good at switching weapons fast enough to handle both skills and a lot of people died as a result. My advice is just pick one or the other (bard I'm guessing since that's what you wanted)

[Mefra]

I have had a few experiences playing with Bard/Clerics in my parties, gotta tell ya, not a big fan. The tanks all wanted him to heal and the Wiz all wanted MP. All the people I played with were not that good at switching weapons fast enough to handle both skills and a lot of people died as a result. My advice is just pick one or the other (bard I'm guessing since that's what you wanted)

That's exactly the thing I'm afraid of...Can you tell me some more? Where those guys who were Bard/Cleric just not good or is it really almost impossible to use both at the same time. I know that with my Rogue/Cleric I can't use them both at the same time, cause I need to put on xbow xtreme every time, which also takes 2 seconds. Then I can make 1 or 2 shots and I'll have to switch again.

Furthermore, I know that the weapon switching takes some time to perfect, but it can be done (unless you've got a lag at the moment you're trying to switch).

Neither bard, nor cleric has those skills that you'll have to put up again...other than a few skills from cleric like int/str increase (which is a real pain in the ass, if you can't use that one...)

You're right that I'm gonna take at least a Bard. That's because I've already got a Rogue/Cleric, which might not do the trick quite as well as a full int, but I'd like to try out a bard...

[AngelEyes]

Well, the basic use of the two buff classes that everyone wants is their HP or MP kept up, they don't want to pot. In a small party of maybe two other chrs it would be easier, but if you get into larger parties, I just found that the players couldn't keep the HP up while doing the bard buffs and by the time weapons were switch, it was too late, the tank was dead. Now at higher levels it's probably better as you have more group heals available, but I was playing in the 3x parties and it just didn't work. The argument against this is, in larger parties there will most likely be a cleric since they are pretty popular (at least on my server), to which I reply, what's the point of having a cleric if your looking for large parties, just play the bard because pure bards are pretty rare. My opinion they are a fun class, you can solo with them same as a wiz, since they do pretty good damage (you still die same as wiz) and you can help damage deal in parties which is appreciated, or you can switch and use all the buff spells. It's a pretty versatile character with lots of options open to it.

The other tough thing about the weapon switch is you go from a 2h weapon with the bard, to a 1h and shield for the cleric. That makes it tough as well, unless of course you opt not to use a shield while in Cleric mode. I've heard people mention on here there are macro's for weapon switching, but that's technically illegal, so I'll leave that up to you.

[Shine]

This is why good euro's do NOT use both their main and sub class in a pt. When in a pt you will want to stick with one class. People who just try to use both main and sub classes in a party just end up being a bad class on both instead of really good one on one. If you want to be a bard/cleric, and there are no other clerics, just use whatever is needed more. Cleric sub is usually used more for pvp or solo grinding purposes.

That's exactly the thing I'm afraid of...Can you tell me some more? Where those guys who were Bard/Cleric just not good or is it really almost impossible to use both at the same time. I know that with my Rogue/Cleric I can't use them both at the same time, cause I need to put on xbow xtreme every time, which also takes 2 seconds. Then I can make 1 or 2 shots and I'll have to switch again.

Furthermore, I know that the weapon switching takes some time to perfect, but it can be done (unless you've got a lag at the moment you're trying to switch).

Neither bard, nor cleric has those skills that you'll have to put up again...other than a few skills from cleric like int/str increase (which is a real pain in the ass, if you can't use that one...)

You're right that I'm gonna take at least a Bard. That's because I've already got a Rogue/Cleric, which might not do the trick quite as well as a full int, but I'd like to try out a bard...

The thing is, its not the buffs that go away when you switch weapons thats the problem(which clerics and bard have important skills which go away), it is trying to use skills on both ends while switching weapons while rebuffing every time. I don't think that will work. You probably wont even buff since it would be a waste, and that means giving up tambours, dances, int and str buffs, for what ever little hp/mp you can heal before the other one is needed. Bards will also have to mana cycle themselves since mana switch goes away when you switch, and that just means one more person to buff.

[Mefra]

Hmm, okay...

So this means weapon switching ain't an option. So, does a Wizard level much faster (let's pretend on solo play) than a Bard? If he doesn't level much faster, I would be far better off taking a cleric as a sub, even though dual weapon ain't an option. At least I could give myself RD and bless for the whole group while needed.

[AngelEyes]

This is why good euro's do NOT use both their main and sub class in a pt. When in a pt you will want to stick with one class. People who just try to use both main and sub classes in a party just end up being a bad class on both instead of really good one on one. If you want to be a bard/cleric, and there are no other clerics, just use whatever is needed more. Cleric sub is usually used more for pvp or solo grinding purposes.

Shine said what I was trying to say much more clearly than I got across.

A wizard will level more quickly simply because they do more damage, but as I said before a bard is a pretty good damage dealer themselves plus when it comes to parties, you can usually, like a cleric, get into parties much higher than your own because everyone wants the mana buff, so this in itself leads to pretty fast lvling. The other night I got my bard from 17-22 in 2hrs without a ticket simply b/c I was in a high level party buffing.

As a side note, when you restore mana in a party and there are lots of mobs around, stick with mana cycle and don't use mana wind, wind creates a lot of aggro for yourself and cycle doesn't. You'll find yourself running very quickly.

[Mefra]

Okay, that means it ain't gonna be a wiz. Probably a cleric. Or would warlock be something...Don't think so

[QuestionMark]

Bard/Cleric if u insist for bard

[Shadroth]

Bard sub Cleric is really the only way to go

In Parties the Cleric Buffs with added Tambour and if possible dance (need another bard for that) are extreemly powerful.

Also the bard is surprisingly good at attacking - much more powerful than ppl think.

For solo pvp i use both bard and cleric. Against STR usually I bind, switch to cleric and use offering. This works very very well against everything except chinese Bow and Rogues. If bind fails the bards own nukes (2 x 186% and 1 x 368% all with splash) are the fastest to launch in the game, and the shortest cooldown, and can deal a good amount of damage.

Bard sub Cleric is one of the best builds vs wizards (you fire too fast - a bard can launch 2 attacks before a wizard has the first charged), is good vs glaives, blades, and swords, but will get pwned my Bows and crossbows.

Bar sub cleric is a great build - you'll need all the bard skills. From cleric get Recovry Division, Healing cycle, hold word, charity, faith, heavenly rage, offering, Bless, body blessing, and soul blessing.

Enjoy

Strauss - lvl 80 Bard sub Cleric, Mercury.
GM the40thieves

[borat2]

go cleric, just ignore the crying of everyone most of them just want a buff to feel stronger you should decide who really needs those buffs anyway

[Kitchen]

I have several questions for body/soul blessing.
1)do they stay on YOURSELF after weapon switch?
2)Do they stay on your party members after weapon switch?
3)Do they stay on party members after they leave the party?

Would body blessing (+phy defense) be enuf to max out for parties? considering most mobs are str based.

I might max it out if 1 and or 2 is yes.

[Shadroth]

1)do they stay on YOURSELF after weapon switch?

No (unfortunately)

2)Do they stay on your party members after weapon switch?

Yes

3)Do they stay on party members after they leave the party?

Yes

I'd definately max out those buffs (Including body deity which also stays). They really help the party a lot even if you cant use them on yourself.

[PureStr]

I'd go bard/wizz if i were you.

Wizzes are alwyas needed in parties because of the damage and bards
are super useful too. But if theres already a bard in the pt, ur just gonna get refused.

[Advancechao]

^I always thought that having two bards in the party was ideal. Two people healing MP and giving amazing group buffs.

[Shadroth]

But if theres already a bard in the pt, ur just gonna get refused.

Having 2 bards in a party actually gives you the strongest buffs in the game. Any party with 1 bard would be idiotic refusing a 2nd bard.

2 bards opens up the Dance line of buffs. So you can get 38% magic and physical damage increase, and 38% physical and magical damage absorption, as well as Mana and Healing buffs.

If only there were more pure bards about I could use these skills more often...

[Advancechao]

But if theres already a bard in the pt, ur just gonna get refused.

Having 2 bards in a party actually gives you the strongest buffs in the game. Any party with 1 bard would be idiotic refusing a 2nd bard.

2 bards opens up the Dance line of buffs. So you can get 38% magic and physical damage increase, and 38% physical and magical damage absorption, as well as Mana and Healing buffs.

If only there were more pure bards about I could use these skills more often...

Yeah, in the future I would love to see an 8-man party with just bards in it...
I might lag out from the skill effects. But I heard that you can't attack while the buffs are running, is that true?

[Shadroth]

I heard that you can't attack while the buffs are running, is that true?

Absolutely not true. Bards can use any of their attacks while the skills are running. There is a random chance of the buff turning off when u get hit by a monster, but as u lvl up this chance goes down thx to passive skills like screen dance and tripping.

My Ideal party? Would be 4 bards, 2 cleric, and 2 wizards. You'd have so much protection that tankers would be redundant and you'd be in ultimate nuker heaven!

Cleric offering with bard dance buff does 1400% magic damage. Add 31 INT from soul deity, a good wep, and zerk and you're probably looking at 400k+ damage. I really need to test his someday...

[Mefra]

Hey guys, thanks for all the replies. I'm gonna go with a pure bard first and I'm gonna decide at level 40 which sub to take. Currently I think it's gonna be a cleric sub.

One last question, I know that Recovery Division is great, but is there also a recovery division for the whole party?

[Advancechao]

Yes, Recovery Division is a party buff. Only you have to cast it. After casting it, it will remain for 300 seconds (5 minutes) and autoheal the person with the least HP. If you are not in a party it will only heal you. It also attracts a massive amount of aggro from monsters so watch out.

[subzero]

chinese char ftw..but euro wiz/bard is also good

[Mefra]

Yes, Recovery Division is a party buff. Only you have to cast it. After casting it, it will remain for 300 seconds (5 minutes) and autoheal the person with the least HP. If you are not in a party it will only heal you. It also attracts a massive amount of aggro from monsters so watch out.

Okay thanks, this would mean that I could stay bard as a main and only use the RD and bless for the party. With a good party Recovery Division should be almost enough to keep them alive. Besides, there should be another cleric in the party...

[AngelEyes]

My Ideal party? Would be 4 bards, 2 cleric, and 2 wizards. You'd have so much protection that tankers would be redundant and you'd be in ultimate nuker heaven!

I was in a party very similar to this last night, except it was 4 wizards, 2 Clerics and my bard (still no dancing )Most were around level 27-29 and we were fighting Kokouru's, no problem there at all, it was actually a pretty efficient party mobs were killed very quickly, I just had to be on my toes to keep all their MP up.

[hootsh]

I would advice you to go Bard/Wizard..for pvp purposes and leveling when no pt is around.

[Mefra]

I would advice you to go Bard/Wizard..for pvp purposes and leveling when no pt is around.

Wouldn't cleric be better for pvp. I think that a bard ain't that good pvp wise, but a cleric should be able to handle himself...

Besides, I also have a Rogue/Cleric which will be my main character. That one is very pvp oriented...