PR0METHEUS wrote:I just don't see anything wrong with using religion to explain things that science cannot, yet, explain. I don't see it as a crutch.
Then maybe you should open your eyes more and realize it is a crutch. Like I said before, don't know if it was this thread, in the absense of evidence you don't create something or make something up. It's not logical, it's irrational, and down right retarded in my opinion. To accept all the science we have now but for the parts we can't explain yet totally shutdown what makes you human, a complex brain, is just beyond me. No proof? Stop believing.
Pinkly did a wonderful job too.
pinklyunfarted wrote:in physics, some particles have yet to be deteced but are sometimes assumed to exist for those reasons [e.g., theories that predict or require the existance of those particles]
They do it in physics, so why not for religion? They have a theory, and want to try to prove it, so they make assumptions for the existence of things that are required for the theory to work.
Ummm, theories make predictions of these particles based on experimentation, observation and mathematical calculation. You don't have a theory, so stop trying to justify your rationale. You can't say "I observe this tree. How did it get here? I have no idea. My theory is this guy named God made it!"
heroo wrote:and btw, aren't you a satanist? isn't Satan a character from the Bible or Quran?
hmm, you say character as if it's a story..oh wait, it IS a story! mauahahaha
But no, you must understand what (most) satanists view. The idea of God or Satan to a satanist is not the same idea that most people have. Satanist do not believe in dieties or greater "beings" that have super abilities. The word satan comes from ancient hebrew with a rough translation being "the accuser", and that is the main reason it is used. Satanism can be viewed more as a critique of christianity and other "white magic" religions. To a satanist there is only one god, the self. To me, I am god. Why? Because I'm the most important to me. Yes, I care about others, but my survival and fulfillment of my aspirations are most important. So, the use of the terms "god" "satan" etc are not the same. Some satanists practice a whole ritualistic thing with alters and chants and shit because, as LeVay believed, they feel that the ritualistic practices are necessary for people. I don't believe that, but I believe a lot of what Satanism has to offer.
so you also live by some kind of religion/lifestyle?
No different to me, only our religions/lifestyles differ.
''When I die, make sure they bury me upside down, so that the world can kiss my ass.''
heroo wrote:and btw, aren't you a satanist? isn't Satan a character from the Bible or Quran?
hmm, you say character as if it's a story..oh wait, it IS a story! mauahahaha
But no, you must understand what (most) satanists view. The idea of God or Satan to a satanist is not the same idea that most people have. Satanist do not believe in dieties or greater "beings" that have super abilities. The word satan comes from ancient hebrew with a rough translation being "the accuser", and that is the main reason it is used. Satanism can be viewed more as a critique of christianity and other "white magic" religions. To a satanist there is only one god, the self. To me, I am god. Why? Because I'm the most important to me. Yes, I care about others, but my survival and fulfillment of my aspirations are most important. So, the use of the terms "god" "satan" etc are not the same. Some satanists practice a whole ritualistic thing with alters and chants and shit because, as LeVay believed, they feel that the ritualistic practices are necessary for people. I don't believe that, but I believe a lot of what Satanism has to offer.
so you also live by some kind of religion/lifestyle?
No different to me, only our religions/lifestyles differ.
I have beliefs, yes but beliefs don't = religion.
I live according to my beliefs, but do I believe in the supernatural? no
If the concept of us being all one consciousness's and us being one thing that lives endless through the cycle of nature the only clear emotion would be understanding . we be in a utopia
I guess I just see science as a way to explain the details of how God created the world we live in. I see no harm in believing that God (or pick your favorite Diety) created everything in this universe, but I don't want to simply accept it at face value. I like to study science to see how things in the world work and how they came to be. Maybe we'll get a more complete understanding of it all someday, maybe we won't.
Missing the good times in SRO...
SRO: 1x, STR Blader (Thebes) 54, STR blader (Venice) 0x, INT wizard (Venice) 19, INT spear (Venice) 34, STR rogue/bard (Venus) 0x, STR blader (Venus) 8x, INT bard/cleric (Gaia)
Whats so unscientific about the existence of a being of greater knowledge than us, that has made other beings to be like them? One being creating other beings seem not so far fetched to be honest. With the cloning of animals becoming so prevalent. I truly don’t see how science and a creator can contrast. Just because we cant explain something with our science, that doesn’t make it irrefutably wrong. Why does the belief in a creator have to = supernatural or superstious? The concept of a creator and science could mesh well together. It’s the introduction of religion/politics that creates the division. I feel this topic would be more accurate if called religion vs science. Religion limits the concepts of the God(s.) I use the term God(s) because even in the most prominent monothiestic religions God is refered to in the multiple (a race of beings), not the single. So Gods is more appropriate. Why cant there be a team of scientists who created things as we know it? we have ruined and mystified this harmonous relationship of creator and science with our pathetic religions/vain attempts to appease to the Gods(and sometimes our pathetic attempts at science that restrict the Gods in our eyes.) I dunno, I could add more, but my opinions don’t matter. Maybe this will stimulate thought in the minds of religious and anti-religious thinkers.
Not many Ninja's exist today, yet they all have indomitable fighting skills as a part of Ninjitsu [TankMePlease] - [Ninjitsu] - [Venus]
As i said to heroo, you don't understand how science works. Btw in the 21st century religion =/= science.
“Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms (of government) those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny” - Thomas Jefferson
ArchYourFace wrote:Whats so unscientific about the existence of a being of greater knowledge than us, that has made other beings to be like them? One being creating other beings seem not so far fetched to be honest. With the cloning of animals becoming so prevalent. I truly don’t see how science and a creator can contrast. Just because we cant explain something with our science, that doesn’t make it irrefutably wrong. Why does the belief in a creator have to = supernatural or superstious? The concept of a creator and science could mesh well together. It’s the introduction of religion/politics that creates the division. I feel this topic would be more accurate if called religion vs science. Religion limits the concepts of the God(s.) I use the term God(s) because even in the most prominent monothiestic religions God is refered to in the multiple (a race of beings), not the single. So Gods is more appropriate. Why cant there be a team of scientists who created things as we know it? we have ruined and mystified this harmonous relationship of creator and science with our pathetic religions/vain attempts to appease to the Gods(and sometimes our pathetic attempts at science that restrict the Gods in our eyes.) I dunno, I could add more, but my opinions don’t matter. Maybe this will stimulate thought in the minds of religious and anti-religious thinkers.
Because creationism goes out of the window at the first mention of it in an intelligent world. Because there is countless hypothesis how life started to exist that are much more rational than creationism, self replicating molecules hypothesis for example, i used to have a bookmark of it but i reformatted. We are very close to discovering the real beginning and I'm really interested how religion will explain it and treat it, I'll assume it's the work of the Devil.
There might be a species much more intelligent and capable than us but still there is no reason to believe they would make us :S.
ArchYourFace wrote:again, it appears that you read 1-2 lines from my post and responded. not a good way to debate.
I read all Lines what you want is for science and religious institutions to mesh; science doesn't work on the same irrational spectrum religion runs on. As i said; you don't understand how science works.
“Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms (of government) those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny” - Thomas Jefferson
ArchYourFace wrote:again, it appears that you read 1-2 lines from my post and responded. not a good way to debate.
I read all Lines what you want is for science and religious institutions to mesh; science doesn't work on the same irrational spectrum religion runs on. As i said; you don't understand how science works.
you clearly dont comprehend the anti religious spectrum of my arguement. you much like religious people throw around your cliched beliefs and wont think outside the box. a creator (group) doenst have to equal silly superstitions and outlandish fables. we can only base what we know off of what we have. who's to say there isnt more that what we see? when we compare ourselves to the expanse of the universe, we certainly cant be so cock-sure of our petty sciences.
Not many Ninja's exist today, yet they all have indomitable fighting skills as a part of Ninjitsu [TankMePlease] - [Ninjitsu] - [Venus]
ArchYourFace wrote:you clearly dont comprehend the anti religious spectrum of my arguement. you much like religious people throw around your cliched beliefs and wont think outside the box. a creator (group) doenst have to equal silly superstitions and outlandish fables. we can only base what we know off of what we have. who's to say there isnt more that what we see? when we compare ourselves to the expanse of the universe, we certainly cant be so cock-sure of our petty sciences.
ArchYourFace wrote:... and wont think outside the box.
Judge wrote:...you don't understand how science works.
Yup. One thing that science strives for is to think outside the box, as long as the outside of that box contains some scientific merit. God and religion have no basis in science so science can't go 'outside the box' in that retrospect. If you haven't already read the thread please do so. If you still have questions we'd be glad to answer them. On the other hand, if you're just going to post to be an apologetic for faith please don't. Respect our sanity.
The funny thing is, is that religion keeps being brought into the argument against what I said. When I never mentioned religion. I was referring to a higher science. A knowledge the supersedes our own. But continue with youre damn near religious approach to your science. Cause certainly, we have all the answers, the humans on this 3rd planet from our sun have found all of the answers. Thank God.
Not many Ninja's exist today, yet they all have indomitable fighting skills as a part of Ninjitsu [TankMePlease] - [Ninjitsu] - [Venus]
Well, the entire universe as we know it could exist completely inside a computer simulation in an advanced alien technology chip sitting on someone's desk in the "real world". Or perhaps we're all part of The Matrix.
We can still use science to determine how everything inside our universe works, and even how it began, but there could be some force out there that we can never fully understand.
Missing the good times in SRO...
SRO: 1x, STR Blader (Thebes) 54, STR blader (Venice) 0x, INT wizard (Venice) 19, INT spear (Venice) 34, STR rogue/bard (Venus) 0x, STR blader (Venus) 8x, INT bard/cleric (Gaia)
ArchYourFace wrote:theres clearly things we dont yet understand. how long was the world believed to be flat? it doesnt have to be superstitious or religious.
ArchYourFace wrote:theres clearly things we dont yet understand. how long was the world believed to be flat? it doesnt have to be superstitious or religious.
You mean...the world isn't flat?!!?!!?
well some peoples world might be.
Not many Ninja's exist today, yet they all have indomitable fighting skills as a part of Ninjitsu [TankMePlease] - [Ninjitsu] - [Venus]
ArchYourFace wrote:theres clearly things we dont yet understand. how long was the world believed to be flat? it doesnt have to be superstitious or religious.
No offense, but religion is an accepted form of brain washing. Having "faith" is your choice but if you do not know who has control of your mind then you need to find out. You can not fool everyone but if you fool the right ones then the rest will follow. As Timothy Leary once said, whom ever control your eyes controls you.
"I believe man made god out of ignorance and fear. If god made man, then why the hell would he put us here! I thought he was suppose to be the all loving? The same god that let Hitler put the Jews in the ovens?" -Dead Prez
