Faith - False or?

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:17 am

Religion is the basis of morality in this world.
That is one of the main purposes of the Bible.

AngelMare · Post by **AngelMare** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:21 am

Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.

+ 1

Judge · Post by **Judge** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:28 am

Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.

Man creates laws, man associates laws with the supernatural to curb indecent behavior; man is the source of religion, therefore the source of all that is good and evil in this word. Evil and morality is relative, to you stealing may be immoral and evil, to others; a way of life.

"I know no good, nor evil for I have yet to be taught a distinction."

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:36 am

Judge wrote:
Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.

Man creates laws

no, that would be God when he gave Moses the 10 commandments.

Judge wrote:man is the source of religion therefore the source of all that is good and evil in this word

and that would be because of sin

TOloseGT · Post by **TOloseGT** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:38 am

Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.
That is one of the main purposes of the Bible.

now lets not get carried away here. a lot of horrific events happened in the name of *insert religion*

those "golden rules" have been around long before the Bible

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:42 am

TOloseGT wrote:
those "golden rules" have been around long before the Bible

like?

Pilot · Post by **Pilot** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:44 am

AngelMare wrote:
Pilot wrote:Religion is the core of all evil in this world. End of discussion.

lol who ever said that , asking to not lie , not do any crimes or sins , something that u urself can feel its the right thing to do .
how can this be evil ? evil is something that humans bring when they chose diffrent passes than those they are supposed to follow , when they do that in wrong way , and likely insisting it , when they follow their own desires , and let their greedness rule them .. thats what is called " Evil " , Religeons always fight evil .

Listen. There are two kinds of religious people in this world. One group of people fight over it/make it their life/make it their obsession/become hopelessly retarded buffoons who believe religion is the answer to everything in life. The other group, which constitutes 1% of all those who believe in a religion, use it to actually make their lives better. Its the other 99% of the population that is oh so dearly Farking up the world we live in.

It is not an exaggeration to say the Iraq War and the whole middle eastern mess is a modern crusade.

Important things to note: confuscious's teachings and Buddhism, are not religion. They are rather a set of moral principles made for you to lead a moral life.

No one can prove that God exists. What will happen when we find out there was no God? What will you faithfuls do then? No human being knows what religion he/she believes in until the day he/she dies.

TOloseGT · Post by **TOloseGT** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:46 am

ancient greeks practiced the golden rule, buddha practiced and preached the golden rule, confucius practiced and preached the golden rule.

are u saying God sent them a manuscript of morals also?

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:48 am

my answer is that God influenced them but of course this answer will be refuted

Pilot wrote:No human being knows what religion he/she believes in until the day he/she dies.

how will they know if they are dead?

Reise · Post by **Reise** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:49 am

Religion may not be the source of -all- evil, but it is the source of the greatest hypocricy.

TOloseGT · Post by **TOloseGT** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:51 am

Morgoth wrote:my answer is that God influenced them but of course this answer will be refuted

naturally.

ur answer to nething will be "God did it", so what's the point?

Judge · Post by **Judge** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:51 am

Morgoth wrote:my answer is that God influenced them but of course this answer will be refuted

Pilot wrote:No human being knows what religion he/she believes in until the day he/she dies.

how will they know if they are dead?

He is alluding to an after-life, and your argument is redundant; reading comprehension, go get some.

Here i will help:

Judge wrote:Evil and morality is relative, to you stealing may be immoral and evil, to others; a way of life.

"I know no good, nor evil for I have yet to be taught a distinction."

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:53 am

Judge wrote:
Morgoth wrote:my answer is that God influenced them but of course this answer will be refuted

Pilot wrote:No human being knows what religion he/she believes in until the day he/she dies.

how will they know if they are dead?

He is alluding to an after-lifer, and your argument is redundant; reading comprehension, go get some.

so you say there is an after life then? i thought you didn't believe in that. how can there be an afterlife without God?

TOloseGT · Post by **TOloseGT** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:53 am

there are other religions besides christianity u know

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:54 am

Judge · Post by **Judge** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 1:56 am

Morgoth wrote:
Judge wrote:
He is alluding to an after-lifer, and your argument is redundant; reading comprehension, go get some.

so you say there is an after life then? i thought you didn't believe in that. how can there be an afterlife without God?

I said he is alluding to an after-life, i never posted that i believe in an after life.

Nuklear wrote:So, in the absence of knowledge you fall back on something that's not based on knowledge? Ya, that makes sense.

Nuklear's question.

Pilot · Post by **Pilot** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:02 am

Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.
That is one of the main purposes of the Bible.

In addition to a literal begging for the reader to "praise" God, "love" God, "make God your lifelong passion" pleading or better yet, "go to hell if you dont believe in the Holy Trinity".

Its a great book to read.

XemnasXD · Post by **XemnasXD** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:05 am

God decides what is Sin and what is not. Therefore God created the idea of Sin.

Destroy God and you will Destroy sin because without God there would be no one to judge what is Sinful.

lol@ religion being the basis of morality. More ppl have died or been killed, raped, burned, or otherwise annihilated in the name of "God" than in the name of anyone else.

Morgoth · Post by **Morgoth** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:29 am

XemnasXD wrote:
Destroy God and you will Destroy sin because without God there would be no one to judge what is Sinful.

good luck with that

HyorunmarouZ · Post by **HyorunmarouZ** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:44 am

Morgoth wrote:
XemnasXD wrote:
Destroy God and you will Destroy sin because without God there would be no one to judge what is Sinful.

good luck with that

It would be even more difficult because Religion is a shield for the criminals. If you are a person near god, many people will vouch for you no matter what kind of crimes and "immoral" behaviour you have.

God is power and Religion the tool that allows the few people on top of its institution to control that massive power.

Nuklear · Post by **Nuklear** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:13 am

Judge wrote:
Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.

Man creates laws, man associates laws with the supernatural to curb indecent behavior; man is the source of religion, therefore the source of all that is good and evil in this word. Evil and morality is relative, to you stealing may be immoral and evil, to others; a way of life.

"I know no good, nor evil for I have yet to be taught a distinction."

Spot-fucking-on.
*e-hug*

This thread has just been an apologists haven. Instead of answering why they believe with no proof, they go the usual mile and explain things, and twist them, according to the same thing they can't acknowledge has no basis in reality. I can only take religious people seriously when they admit that it's irrational and has no scientific backing. Of course, then they wouldn't be religious, bat-shit-crazy, now would they?

BrokenSaint · Post by **BrokenSaint** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:33 am

This is a very taboo topic. This will only spark people to contradict others peoples beliefs/religions. What we believe is what we believe.

EDIT: Unlocked. Let's stay clean.

pr0klobster · Post by **pr0klobster** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:23 pm

XemnasXD wrote:God decides what is Sin and what is not. Therefore God created the idea of Sin.

Destroy God and you will Destroy sin because without God there would be no one to judge what is Sinful.

lol@ religion being the basis of morality. More ppl have died or been killed, raped, burned, or otherwise annihilated in the name of "God" than in the name of anyone else.

got (several) links for that? I think Hitler's 6 million might be higher...

pr0klobster · Post by **pr0klobster** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:30 pm

Nuklear wrote:
Judge wrote:
Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.

Man creates laws, man associates laws with the supernatural to curb indecent behavior; man is the source of religion, therefore the source of all that is good and evil in this word. Evil and morality is relative, to you stealing may be immoral and evil, to others; a way of life.

"I know no good, nor evil for I have yet to be taught a distinction."

Spot-fucking-on.
*e-hug*

This thread has just been an apologists haven. Instead of answering why they believe with no proof, they go the usual mile and explain things, and twist them, according to the same thing they can't acknowledge has no basis in reality. I can only take religious people seriously when they admit that it's irrational and has no scientific backing. Of course, then they wouldn't be religious, bat-shit-crazy, now would they?

Here you go:

I believe in God. I have no "proof" of His existence. I don't need proof. I choose to have faith. Without faith (and God), I'm nothing. I would have nothing to look forward to after I pass on, I have no one to fall back on in life because everyone dies. It's a fact.

God is never-changing.

You can call it irrational. That's why it's faith

These are my personal beliefs. I won't go around telling everyone else they're wrong. If they ask about God, I tell 'em.

Oh and to the person who says "man associates laws with the supernatural to curb indecent behavior", first you must define indecent, right...? If there were no rules, what happens? A supernatural being isn't required to define morality. That said- there are God's laws, and there are man's laws.

Not too bad of a discussion, but I could do without the flames.

SM-Count · Post by **SM-Count** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:40 pm

Morales are personal, so it comes down to personal beliefs. Ethics are what guard communities, not morales. The two words are not interchangable, or at least not in philosophy. (I would link you to m-w.com for the terms but that would require too much work on my part just to mock someone)

As for Faith, I personally believe in the comma and period whole heartedly and shun ellipses marks.

pr0klobster · Post by **pr0klobster** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:52 pm

SM-Count wrote:Morales are personal, so it comes down to personal beliefs. Ethics are what guard communities, not morales. The two words are not interchangable, or at least not in philosophy. (I would link you to m-w.com for the terms but that would require too much work on my part just to mock someone)

As for Faith, I personally believe in the comma and period whole heartedly and shun ellipses marks.

morals
One entry found.

moral[2,noun]

Main Entry:
2mor·al Listen to the pronunciation of 2moral
Pronunciation:
\ˈmȯr-əl, ˈmär-; 3 is mə-ˈral\
Function:
noun
Date:
15th century

1 a: the moral significance or practical lesson (as of a story) b: a passage pointing out usually in conclusion the lesson to be drawn from a story2plural a: moral practices or teachings : modes of conduct b: ethics

ethics
2 entries found.

Main Entry:
eth·ic Listen to the pronunciation of ethic
Pronunciation:
\ˈe-thik\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English ethik, from Middle French ethique, from Latin ethice, from Greek ēthikē, from ēthikos
Date:
14th century

1plural but sing or plural in constr : the discipline dealing with what is good and bad and with moral duty and obligation2 a: a set of moral principles : a theory or system of moral values <the present-day materialistic ethic> <an old-fashioned work ethic> —often used in plural but singular or plural in construction <an elaborate ethics><Christian ethics> bplural but sing or plural in constr : the principles of conduct governing an individual or a group <professional ethics> c: a guiding philosophy d: a consciousness of moral importance <forge a conservation ethic>3plural : a set of moral issues or aspects (as rightness) <debated the ethics of human cloning>

Jstar1 · Post by **Jstar1** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:06 pm

SM-Count wrote:Morales are personal, so it comes down to personal beliefs. Ethics are what guard communities, not morales. The two words are not interchangable, or at least not in philosophy. (I would link you to m-w.com for the terms but that would require too much work on my part just to mock someone)

As for Faith, I personally believe in the comma and period whole heartedly and shun ellipses marks.

being moral and ethical is the same thing.

Morgoth wrote:Religion is the basis of morality in this world.
That is one of the main purposes of the Bible.

you dont have to be religious to be moral

Nuklear · Post by **Nuklear** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:48 pm

pr0klobster wrote:I believe in God. I have no "proof" of His existence. I don't need proof. I choose to have faith.

I suppose that's ok if you were a mental patient and weren't taking your meds. I'll go out on a limb and say you aren't though. Ever heard of scientologists? Ya, that's one extreme example of why faith isn't ok.

pr0klobster wrote:Without faith (and God), I'm nothing. I would have nothing to look forward to after I pass on, I have no one to fall back on in life because everyone dies. It's a fact.

Yes, that's why you make the most of the time you actually have. Just because you don't live forever, which we actually will with new technologies, doesn't mean you're worthless. You make impacts daily and may even contribute something good to society. You're using religion as a crutch to 'ease' death. Every creature dyes and that's a fact. Come to grips with it instead of placing irrational beliefs that their still alive only somewhere else.

pr0klobster wrote:You can call it irrational. That's why it's faith :)

*nods*

pr0klobster wrote:These are my personal beliefs. I won't go around telling everyone else they're wrong.

*psst* That's because you can't. Your beliefs are based on a book with no evidence backing it up.

pr0klobster wrote:Not too bad of a discussion, but I could do without the flames.

A man needs to vent when someone can't be logical in conversation, or life :P.

SM-Count · Post by **SM-Count** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:12 pm

Jstar1 wrote:
SM-Count wrote:Morales are personal, so it comes down to personal beliefs. Ethics are what guard communities, not morales. The two words are not interchangable, or at least not in philosophy. (I would link you to m-w.com for the terms but that would require too much work on my part just to mock someone)

As for Faith, I personally believe in the comma and period whole heartedly and shun ellipses marks.

being moral and ethical is the same thing.

In the context of philosophy, which is what we're debating right now, no it's not. Morality is what your conscience tells you is right or what you know/believe to be right while ethics is what the population accepts as right. To be immoral means to go against your own conscience and do something bad intentionally while being unethical means that what you do is something considered bad by the community. The terms have completely different denotations when used in philosophical/religious arguments and are not synonymous. For example, MLK jr. can be considered unethical but not immoral.

Pan_Raider(`_´) · Post by **Pan_Raider(`_´)** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:25 pm

Dang, god has struck us again(that is if you believe in him, but like said in http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=67354 , science isn't clearer than faith.

After watching many comedy shows, presentations from professors and even thought about god for myself(for a whole 10 minutes :banghead:

),I've decided to call money my god:
1. I can touch, smell, feel, see, *taste* it
2. It secures me many necessities
3. I have to work for it

dollar dollar bill ya'll

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