warlocks, like to hear from 4x +

CareBear · Post by **CareBear** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:41 pm

I've got a lvl 29 (28 masteries) warlock, and I'm really not seeing the point of this build yet, so before I delevel and get wiz would like to hear from higher lvl warlocks. I know I hated my chinese int till lvl 40 or so, but from then on wouldn't look back.

Why warlock sucks
- i just don't get the point of damage over time. why do 1500 damage in 3 seconds when you can do it in 1
- sleep/stun are great for escaping from spawns, but if you know how to play this is almost pointless. Any hit wakes them up, so no good for parties that aren't highly organised
- very few party skills, waste of time if you have buffers anyway
- hp steal is just a money saver, you can't tank, crits do too much damage to ints

Why warlocks rock
- they zerk every 2 minutes
- they live longer than most ints because of hp steal and sleep/stun
- it's funny DOTing lowlevels while they chase u
- save money on HP pots

Keeps popping up in my mind that warlock skills would be better for a tank, but since euro weaps only do int OR str damage a hybrid seems pointless.

SoBlu · Post by **SoBlu** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 6:05 pm

Warlock is one of the advanced classes for Europe that will play a larger role in party play down the road.

If you don't like debuffs and DOTing then switch to Wizzie/Bard etc.

Ive seen some 50+ (im 41) and they are cleric/warlock. They do pretty good and can take down 50+ glaivers dual axe warriors etc with stun.heal. DOT combos.

its all up to how you play.

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:43 pm

I don't know about you but I can tank crits with HP regain. It also depends on what you mean party skills. Warlocks don't really get AoE attack skills for the party until high levels.

Being a Warlock, you DoT attacks do damage no matter if you or the opponent is in the safe zone or not. Warlocks don't have to risk their lives as much as wizards because of this.

Attacking someone doesn't remove stun.

I have my sleep skill at a high level. If a low level attacks a person I put to sleep, they still won't wake up.

caseyd4 · Post by **caseyd4** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 8:38 pm

was Pvping against a lvl 43 Warlock the other day on Eldorado, Im a lvl 40 Chinese Bow with a 7 Gap. The guys buffs/de buffs where amazing he had a noobing lvl 70 with him in low gear and after he casted all his magicy stuff on him i could 1 hit the lvl 70 :O... Pvping the lvl 43 myself was amazingly tought and I thought this build had low hp, ok yea if i could get him froze before he got his first de buff in i could 1 hit him for about 2k damage but if not it was soo annoying and depened on crits. After he fully de buffed me i was only hitting him for 600-800 dmg with Strong Bow :O Took lucky crits to kill him and i onbly managed to do that once in 5 tries

WARLOCKS ARE EVIL

I aint messing with them again

shieldmaiden · Post by **shieldmaiden** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 10:02 pm

i have a quick question regarding level 40+ warlocks.

I'm a pure class cleric and I'm looking at getting warlock as my sub for the sole reason of being able to use warlock's level 40 Mirage skill (minus aggro). I'm pure INT as well and i don't want to go hybrid just for survivability reasons that's why i'm saving my skill points for Mirage.

i hope high level locks can shed more light regarding this issue, if Mirage is worth the wait.

thanks in advance.

CareBear · Post by **CareBear** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 12:50 am

thx for feedback, so they might get better at 4x 5x ... I love dot, but I don't see the point for an int char, would be great for a warrior to draw mobs and do damage at the same time

@caseyd4 lol u expect to beat a lvl 43 anything when you're lvl 40 with a 7 gap??? then you have the ultimate pvp build I guess. Assuming gear is reaso equal and the warlock didn't have a huge gap, then the fact u could beat him at all makes him sound useless

DeShin · Post by **DeShin** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 1:45 am

IMO, it depends on the uniqueness of every characters. Every classes has its own way of dealing the monster/enemy either by killing it with 1 shot or little-by-little damage because imagine if all of the characters were to be made of 1-hit-ko attack, then it would be illogical afterall. And for a warlock to have this DoT, that's what I called the uniqueness of warlock, able to curse the monster first and deal the damage.

locthief · Post by **locthief** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 9:37 pm

Fun part about dots is I have multi killed folks with them. The other day a merchant had some one with not job gear on spamming ress on him. The dots were still going off on him when he was ressed.

As for a few other reason dots are handy. Dots have a % chance to apply cons per tic.They allow you to do other things while they tic like running away. They have a faster cast time then most heavy nukes. While you can block the first attack once it sticks I think block is no longer a factor. When pvping with fighters that spam knock down you are still dealing a good amount of damage with two dots and your point blank damage over time.

I am not a big fan of sleep but it can have it's use given the target can't do any thing for 20 seconds pvp wise. This can allow you to wipe out other targets while they sit there and watch. When I go out thiefing I will sleep the strongest target then one hit all the weaker hunters. You can also sleep a merchant while npc thief beat on his camel. He might be able to heal his transport but you build up enough npc thieves and he is going down.

Fast casting stun is great and I think it will be a little to strong at higer levels when you have two stun spells.

You have great party skills just you don't see them shine till higher levels when those debuffs get nasty.

As for tanking your not a tank. But you can soak damage better then a wizard. And also have the reduce agro area effect spells. If you get agro in a group and there are no tanks to pull it off of you. Just has your reduce agro spell and have you pet attack it. Your pet can tank mobs for you just fine and are easyer to heal. I can't wait for the life leech spell that lets you steal hps from up to 5 targets.

While you can do ok with a warlock at low levels I really don't think they start to shine till 40 +.

Potetgull · Post by **Potetgull** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 9:57 pm

The warlock is kinda an pvp class. stun adn sleep pwns if you start in 1 vs 1:
Nuke->sleep->nuke->stun->curse->curse->nuke->death

And the enemy hasnt touched you.

you say few pt skills, what about: scream mask, the whole raze tree, wheel bind?

warlocks are good vs players.. thats it

Pred · Post by **Pred** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:20 am

Im a level 55 warlock.

My build sucks. Dont make one.

Actually, just dont copy me.

Warlock sucks

Did I mention they suck?

monet · Post by **monet** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:53 pm

im thinking abut warlock too.

it would be nice if anyone else would share expirience?

caseyd4 · Post by **caseyd4** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:34 pm

CareBear wrote:thx for feedback, so they might get better at 4x 5x ... I love dot, but I don't see the point for an int char, would be great for a warrior to draw mobs and do damage at the same time

@caseyd4 lol u expect to beat a lvl 43 anything when you're lvl 40 with a 7 gap??? then you have the ultimate pvp build I guess. Assuming gear is reaso equal and the warlock didn't have a huge gap, then the fact u could beat him at all makes him sound useless

I beat Most lvl 43 @ 40

Infact only one I cant beat is a stupid Str Blader :banghead:

Berto · Post by **Berto** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:28 am

So far i'm a 52 warlock / wizard combo. (Wizard being for stealth, destealth, and teleport). As for pvp warlocks wouldn't shine until down the road as a higher level. They're great for party's but getting 1 hit ko'd really brings my hopes down. The only thing i'm depending on right now is stamina and str stones on all of my equips. Any other warlocks have any opinion on possibly adding str to my build itself?

locthief · Post by **locthief** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:42 am

I thought about building a str heavy warlock. And just focusing on thier life leech and bypass armor skills because int has little to no effect on them. The trap spell we have for example does about 2.2k bypass armor damage even if I am using a level 1 warlock rod.

But other then that your never going to have enough hps fighting a wizard or crossbow user because they are set up to take down tanks with a few hits. It's just a matter of you hiting them first.

San · Post by **San** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 4:18 am

locthief wrote:I thought about building a str heavy warlock. And just focusing on thier life leech and bypass armor skills because int has little to no effect on them. The trap spell we have for example does about 2.2k bypass armor damage even if I am using a level 1 warlock rod.

But other then that your never going to have enough hps fighting a wizard or crossbow user because they are set up to take down tanks with a few hits. It's just a matter of you hiting them first.

wtf?
str heavy warlock completely ruins the build!

CMG230 · Post by **CMG230** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:09 am

to lazy to read other replies but warlocks at lvl 42+(courage raze) is a nessecity in every party. Im a lvl 49 warlock on odin and am a huge asset, and get offers of millions of gold/items to join guilds that form grind parties. COurage raze enhances damage doen to target i beelive 30%, not sure exact number, also you can decrease damage done also by 30% i beleive, then you can reduce defense 30%. these numbers arent exact but ive done testing and it seems to be about 25-30%. This means in jsut 1 skill(courage raze) your really already doing 30% of the mobs health, since you increase all damage done to it by that number, your bringing them down 30% faster. Stuns are mainly for mob control, as in to get mobs off cleric/bard. Or used in pvp, and sleep will end when target is hit, but not stun. Stun last through htis, so 90% of the time ill kill an opponent in pvp before they get out of stun. Damage over time is nice mainly in pvp, but it does a lot of damage in pvm also. At lvl 49 my DOT's tick for about 450 and 620 every second(on 54 penons). So a wiz may hit for 5k damage, but im doing 2500 blood flower, then another thousand in DOT, plus all the damage enhancers you can cast your really contributing most damage to the party. only downfall is pure intel, in pvp its pretty much who gets first hit is the winner vs wiz/rogue, they both got stealth, you dont. My friend who is 53 is pure intel as of now, and is going hybrid now, going to test that out. ill report back later on how that goes, but warlocks are def not pointless

locthief · Post by **locthief** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:17 am

The build as if thier is only one way to build a warlock. And only one way to play them ? Warlocks are not heavy dd nukers like wizards. At low levels a pure int warlock dd might do around the same damage as a wizard but it does not come close top end. When you factor in a wizards damage buff. And it has already been pointed out that fighterloc's can do rather well.

Warlocks don't have only one kind of set skills. your def debuff line can help improve your int based nukes and dots. But it has little to no effect on your cruel spells line or your traps.

normal vamptouch 700ish damage
debuffs + vamptouch 700ish damage
zerk + vamptouch 700ish damage

Most of the skills a warlock can use do not require much if any int at all.
At 44 a warlock can stun a 44 wizard when they try to nuke them because the the stun is faster to cast. Cast trap on the wizard next and then sleep them. Because all three spells are fast casting you should be able to get them all off before the wizard can counter it. The trap will hit for 2.2k damage killing the average lvl 44 wizard. I might be wrong but most wizards at 44 with thier damage buff up do not have more then 2.2k hps.
I have yet to see any proof that going pure int will raise the damage of that trap spell does at all.

Some other skills like the warlocks armor spells and refelct are pretty much a waste of sp if every other class can kill you in 2 hits. And again int will not improve the effects of these two spells.

Also note that I never said it was a great build or that any one else should try it. Only that I thought about making one to see how well they would do.

Atsuten · Post by **Atsuten** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:31 am

there is another post on Rogue/Warlock. That would be str heavy....

Thoughts?

Libertarian · Post by **Libertarian** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:06 am

What about a Warlock/Cleric or Cleric/Warlock? Anyone tried that? I'm thinking about going either way.

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:14 pm

locthief wrote:The build as if thier is only one way to build a warlock. And only one way to play them ? Warlocks are not heavy dd nukers like wizards. At low levels a pure int warlock dd might do around the same damage as a wizard but it does not come close top end. When you factor in a wizards damage buff. And it has already been pointed out that fighterloc's can do rather well.

There isn't a sure way to build a Warlock, but pure int is going in the right direction. Because Warlocks are heavy damage dealers. Just don't expect Warlocks to kill you in one hit.

locthief wrote:Warlocks don't have only one kind of set skills. your def debuff line can help improve your int based nukes and dots. But it has little to no effect on your cruel spells line or your traps.

normal vamptouch 700ish damage
debuffs + vamptouch 700ish damage
zerk + vamptouch 700ish damage

So just because some of your attacks are absolute damage is a reason not to go pure int?

locthief wrote:Most of the skills a warlock can use do not require much if any int at all.
At 44 a warlock can stun a 44 wizard when they try to nuke them because the the stun is faster to cast. Cast trap on the wizard next and then sleep them. Because all three spells are fast casting you should be able to get them all off before the wizard can counter it. The trap will hit for 2.2k damage killing the average lvl 44 wizard. I might be wrong but most wizards at 44 with thier damage buff up do not have more then 2.2k hps.
I have yet to see any proof that going pure int will raise the damage of that trap spell does at all.

Thats only trap damage. There is a change that stun, sleep, or the trap could be resisted. If the Wizard has a Cleric sub and has Holy Ward, Slumber and Bloody Trap won't even work. Not to mention a Wizard can also cast fear almost instantly just like your stun. A wizard is going to one hit regardless if you're hybrid, pure str, or pure int. Unless you block the attack.

locthief wrote:Some other skills like the warlocks armor spells and refelct are pretty much a waste of sp if every other class can kill you in 2 hits. And again int will not improve the effects of these two spells.

I'm pure int and I don't die in 2 hits. Only wizards and rogues can one hit me. Thats nothing special though because wizards one hit people a few levels above them and rogues one hit Chinese nukers in armor with mana shield.

I haven't fully tested it yet but I think reflect does damage even if the last attack kills you. Also, the last book of Reflect casts the skill on everyone in the party.

locthief wrote:Also note that I never said it was a great build or that any one else should try it. Only that I thought about making one to see how well they would do.

Not saying you're wrong or anything but it doesn't seem much better than pure int .

locthief · Post by **locthief** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:24 pm

QUOTE:
I thought about building a str heavy warlock. And just focusing on thier life leech and bypass armor skills because int has little to no effect on them.

QUOTE:
So just because some of your attacks are absolute damage is a reason not to go pure int?

Again if the focus is on that kind of damage then yes I see no reason to go pure int. I know you do fine in pvp Da_Realest but more then a few warlocks are geting to 30+ and start pumping str up a little or wishing they had before. This may be because they are geting one hit by wizards/crossbows and they believe the little extra will help. If that is the only reason people are doing it I tend to agree that it won't help fighting those classes.

QUOTE:
Thats only trap damage. There is a change that stun, sleep, or the trap could be resisted. If the Wizard has a Cleric sub and has Holy Ward, Slumber and Bloody Trap won't even work. Not to mention a Wizard can also cast fear almost instantly just like your stun.

Geting a lot of resists do suck but stun does not seem to be resisted offten. It's a risk I like about playing really pvp would not be any fun if I knew I could kill every one 100% of the time. I have never had a wizard cast fear on me. So many players choose them because they are one hit wonders. But I would love to see some of them use good tactic's like that.
The funny thing about bloody trap is that unlike your dots that are removed as soon as you die the trap keepings going. Nothing like a wizard laughing over your dead corpse only to be blown up a few seconds latter to make your day.

Libertarian one of the nice things about a cleric/warlock is you do not have to eq a warlock rod to use a warlocks agro reduce spell. They also have a lot of spells that can help support a group that do not require you to hold a warlock rod after you cast them. Unlike a bard that has to have the harp eqed for the effects to last.

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:56 pm

locthief wrote:QUOTE:
I thought about building a str heavy warlock. And just focusing on thier life leech and bypass armor skills because int has little to no effect on them.

QUOTE:
So just because some of your attacks are absolute damage is a reason not to go pure int?

Again if the focus is on that kind of damage then yes I see no reason to go pure int. I know you do fine in pvp Da_Realest but more then a few warlocks are geting to 30+ and start pumping str up a little or wishing they had before. This may be because they are geting one hit by wizards/crossbows and they believe the little extra will help. If that is the only reason people are doing it I tend to agree that it won't help fighting those classes.

QUOTE:
Thats only trap damage. There is a change that stun, sleep, or the trap could be resisted. If the Wizard has a Cleric sub and has Holy Ward, Slumber and Bloody Trap won't even work. Not to mention a Wizard can also cast fear almost instantly just like your stun.

Geting a lot of resists do suck but stun does not seem to be resisted offten. It's a risk I like about playing really pvp would not be any fun if I knew I could kill every one 100% of the time. I have never had a wizard cast fear on me. So many players choose them because they are one hit wonders. But I would love to see some of them use good tactic's like that.
The funny thing about bloody trap is that unlike your dots that are removed as soon as you die the trap keepings going. Nothing like a wizard laughing over your dead corpse only to be blown up a few seconds latter to make your day.

Libertarian one of the nice things about a cleric/warlock is you do not have to eq a warlock rod to use a warlocks agro reduce spell. They also have a lot of spells that can help support a group that do not require you to hold a warlock rod after you cast them. Unlike a bard that has to have the harp eqed for the effects to last.

My post wasn't in depth as I wanted it to be because I was in a rush to get to class, but it seems I was able to convey my point to you.

I agree that most wizards don't use tactics to win in pvp. Kill them a few times and then they use Life Control and try again. Kill them a few more times and they try Life Control + Invisible. Kill them even more and they give up. Thats what the majority of wizards do anyway. I've pvped a few that start with fear. Its basically who has the fastest fingers. If I manage to stun, the wizard's dead. If the wizard manages to in place fear, I'm dead.

Its a shame though that wizards and rogues will one skill you regardless of if you debuffed them or not.

I use the Bloody Trap + Slumber combo. Its funny doing that to int characters with low amounts of alchemy or characters below you. Put the laughing skull of death on top of them, put them sleep, and they can't do anything as their doomed to die in a few seconds. Its even better when you cast Bloody Trap and watch as they scramble to safe zone thinking that will save them.

criticalss · Post by **criticalss** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 2:15 am

try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p

Cremat · Post by **Cremat** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 2:02 pm

i have one warlock lvl 30, sub class warrior...

its wonderfull up alone cuz with heavy armor i can freceive a lot of phy dmg and dont fall down... but its slow..., i down the lvl 30 ~ 32 mob with Magical Raze, Decayed and Blood Flowers...

Giant i use Daze and Shield Trash (warrior skill)...

I like to play with warrior... DoT its wonderfull...

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 2:25 pm

criticalss wrote:try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p

You know there are other attacks warlocks have besides the Daze line of skills and Bloody Trap right?

criticalss · Post by **criticalss** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 5:06 pm

Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p
You know there are other attacks warlocks have besides the Daze line of skills and Bloody Trap right?

yes...
like the 214% attack and the hp stealing skill that hits less than regular attack?

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 6:44 pm

criticalss wrote:
Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p
You know there are other attacks warlocks have besides the Daze line of skills and Bloody Trap right?

yes...
like the 214% attack and the hp stealing skill that hits less than regular attack?

DoT attacks, 2 nukes, and 2 hp stealing skills. Shadow armor which does the same damage constantly. Not to mention I got the oh so useful Daze and the Reflect skill.

boast · Post by **boast** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:07 pm

Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:
Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p
You know there are other attacks warlocks have besides the Daze line of skills and Bloody Trap right?

yes...
like the 214% attack and the hp stealing skill that hits less than regular attack?
DoT attacks, 2 nukes, and 2 hp stealing skills. Shadow armor which does the same damage constantly. Not to mention I got the oh so useful Daze and the Reflect skill.

while all a wizard has to do is press 1 button.

I feel like warlock = blader

Da_Realest · Post by **Da_Realest** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:04 pm

boast wrote:
Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:
Da_Realest wrote:
criticalss wrote:try killing someone with holy ward or fire shield on. it's warlock's weakness. max fire shield gives warlocks only 22% success for curse and trap....but wait. the curses and trap have 80% sucess to begin with... so 80-78 is 2%. so the chance of sucess is 2%...................... WTH lol
that is freaking sad! and when i try to frostbite a euro with lv 1 holy ward using lv 1 ice bolt with the 100% frostbite chance it was ressist! never saw that b4.... but good thing is isro is not ksro. ksro always has those buffs on because their pro. but isro has a lot of noobs and botters that don't know anything so they get pwned lol. lv 16 warlock for stun is enough for me =p
You know there are other attacks warlocks have besides the Daze line of skills and Bloody Trap right?

yes...
like the 214% attack and the hp stealing skill that hits less than regular attack?
DoT attacks, 2 nukes, and 2 hp stealing skills. Shadow armor which does the same damage constantly. Not to mention I got the oh so useful Daze and the Reflect skill.

while all a wizard has to do is press 1 button.

I feel like warlock = blader

while most builds only have to press one button to kill a wizard with life control activated.

I feel like wizard = kamikaze

Anyway, for a warlock, all it takes is 2 button presses to kill a wizard. Daze which is faster than a nuke, then Bloody Flower. Dead wizard.

boast · Post by **boast** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 1:03 am

Wizards get fear, though.

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warlocks, like to hear from 4x +

warlocks, like to hear from 4x +

Re: warlocks, like to hear from 4x +

hmm

nice