wht build can kill rogues?

[Flightmeck]

any build can kill each other it all depneds on who has better gear and how you react to a sort of attack

+1
In cape pvp all rogues i see dies a lot more then they kill (including me). That's becauls most players are so scared of or angry with them that they most offen kills them as soon as possible eaven if the rogue does not give any sign of attacking. The reason for this "anger" might be the way most rogues are played: safezone -> stealth -> 1 or 2 hit -> run to safezone. In jobwars or groupwar it might be another story but i wouldn't know cuz i never been in one ^^

[djlogic]

wiz can. warlock i'm not too sure if u have time tot hrow in the fog sight before they hit you.

[juesi]

There's peoples who are too stupid to kill rogues :/ I think the rogue is the easiest build to defeat in pvp, u just need some brainwork to figure out how.

I got 6x rogue by my self, and belive me i can one hit +80 players with that noob stealth tactic. I also got 6x chinese heavy int hybrid, and i easily own all 6x rogues with it, just have to know what to do and when.

Easy way when dagger rogue use the noob stealth tactic, with chinese ppl's who have bicheon mastery, just use ironwall and he cant 1hit u, if u don't have bicheon mastery, then buy high br shield at any level, +18 br and just switch to it during the "skill animation" witch will take like 1-2secs.

If u'r facing dagger rogue with DD on without stealth, just use some fast skill like shouts with int builds and some fast spins with heuksal.(don't know the skill name) that would be enougth to kill rogue coz lack of defence.

With eurobuilds, warriors got KD KB skills just use them, with wizard, its hard to survive coz lack of hp and defence sins ur using robe, but if u can get first hit, use charged wind to KD then nuke.

When rogue is using xbow situation is diffrent. He can mostly kill u, if he's using stealt, coz great range of xbow. He probably is using crossbowextreme (CE), so those fast kill tactics won't work either, chinese ppl's can use defencebuffs like "iron wall" or change to high br shield and wish for block. With str build's rogue cant 1hit u without crit, so u got some time to catch him and kill him, to bow 8and glavie users its easy coz they got some ranged skills, and rogue don't have mutch phydef or hp when CE on.

When ppl's say that rogue don't have fair pvp at all, thats true with every eurobuild, there's not that kind of fight like chinese vs chinese is fighting, its mostly potfight. Euro is bit diffrent pvp's are fast, and there is no potfigth. I would say every euro pvp last less than 2min, when chinese can fight easily over 5min.

[CLOT]

a full STR blader with full Sun set and BR 20+ and atlest 5 lvls higher
it might survive
I have an Rogue myself and i know how good it is the only things that beat me are:
1.10 lvls higher ppl
2.block with shield
3.**** that pk2 edit 2 see stelth

given both similar gears, full farmed, with same technique/intelligence (in short, both good players who know how to play)

blader wins 60%, no need, and now wif 90 cap new skills, blader wif 70+%
no need for sun or even +9 blade, juz +7...the only real chance a rogue can kill blade is only when it KD blader down and then use dagger combo + a prick (and praying prick crits/not blocked)

but still there is always ironwall shield for rescue

oh, and cleric sub blessing huh? i juz spam KD throughout that 45 sec till it runs out

in fact, blader/chinese str bow are euro killers, but blader can survive better and not likely to get 1 shotted

[NobleHunter]

a full STR blader with full Sun set and BR 20+ and atlest 5 lvls higher
it might survive
I have an Rogue myself and i know how good it is the only things that beat me are:
1.10 lvls higher ppl
2.block with shield
3.**** that pk2 edit 2 see stelth

given both similar gears, full farmed, with same technique/intelligence (in short, both good players who know how to play)

blader wins 60%, no need, and now wif 90 cap new skills, blader wif 70+%
no need for sun or even +9 blade, juz +7...the only real chance a rogue can kill blade is only when it KD blader down and then use dagger combo + a prick (and praying prick crits/not blocked)

but still there is always ironwall shield for rescue

oh, and cleric sub blessing huh? i juz spam KD throughout that 45 sec till it runs out

in fact, blader/chinese str bow are euro killers, but blader can survive better and not likely to get 1 shotted

a single prick is enough to take a blader down, if its a crit the blader will probably kiss the floor in a second, its pretty easy to get a critical when the weapon max crit is 26 , if its not a critical then a combo blow or/and mortal wounds is enough, with just a few crits.
About spaming KD skills while the rogue is using bless spell may work with some noobs, if thats the case the rogue just need to switch to cleric again and use heaven glare, bind status FTW and lets see if you can move before your char is dead. The only danger i see attacking bladers is you can get killed by other chars while you are trying to kill him (blocks, ironcastle...) in fact, beside glaviers, bladers are my favorite victims.

[CLOT]

a single prick is enough to take a blader down, if its a crit the blader will probably kiss the floor in a second, its pretty easy to get a critical when the weapon max crit is 26 , if its not a critical then a combo blow or/and mortal wounds is enough, with just a few crits.
About spaming KD skills while the rogue is using bless spell may work with some noobs, if thats the case the rogue just need to switch to cleric again and use heaven glare, bind status FTW and lets see if you can move before your char is dead. The only danger i see attacking bladers is you can get killed by other chars while you are trying to kill him (blocks, ironcastle...) in fact, beside glaviers, bladers are my favorite victims.

well rogue are my fav victims in mercury
and max crit of dagger is 25

if u bind, that means xbow to kill? not a single xbow back then at 80 cap full farmed can kill me wif xbow alone even wif 2 crits in a row, and i hv avg +5 full blue gears only, no honor buff, no prem, no avartar

yes, rogue switching to cleric to heal its hard to kill, its only when it turns on DD and wif dagger, den its a real threat to me, but at same time, its vulnerable too

prick crit on me wif +5 to +7 dagger wouldnt 1 shot a blader even w/o ironwall, snowshield (but the next hit will kill the blader aft prick crit)
and when a dagger has DD on, and its prick didnt crit/blocked + it continues wif DD on, i could kill them off 95% of the time

unless they cancel the DD immediately by switching bac to xbow for KD/cleric & shield for heal, den its another story

[NobleHunter]

a single prick is enough to take a blader down, if its a crit the blader will probably kiss the floor in a second, its pretty easy to get a critical when the weapon max crit is 26 , if its not a critical then a combo blow or/and mortal wounds is enough, with just a few crits.
About spaming KD skills while the rogue is using bless spell may work with some noobs, if thats the case the rogue just need to switch to cleric again and use heaven glare, bind status FTW and lets see if you can move before your char is dead. The only danger i see attacking bladers is you can get killed by other chars while you are trying to kill him (blocks, ironcastle...) in fact, beside glaviers, bladers are my favorite victims.

well rogue are my fav victims in mercury
and max crit of dagger is 25

if u bind, that means xbow to kill? not a single xbow back then at 80 cap full farmed can kill me wif xbow alone even wif 2 crits in a row, and i hv avg +5 full blue gears only, no honor buff, no prem, no avartar

yes, rogue switching to cleric to heal its hard to kill, its only when it turns on DD and wif dagger, den its a real threat to me, but at same time, its vulnerable too

prick crit on me wif +5 to +7 dagger wouldnt 1 shot a blader even w/o ironwall, snowshield (but the next hit will kill the blader aft prick crit)
and when a dagger has DD on, and its prick didnt crit/blocked + it continues wif DD on, i could kill them off 95% of the time

unless they cancel the DD immediately by switching bac to xbow for KD/cleric & shield for heal, den its another story

I said can take the blader down in a second, i never said in 1 hit, of course, the next hit is enough to kill the blader.
And when you say the 95% of the time i imagine you are talking about a non blessed rogue (btw rogue/warlocks can take down bladers without easier than any other build imo). Even rogue/bards can kill bladers without much problems if they know when to attack, after all, rogue is based in surprisse attacks.
And for the record, i can kill bladers with xbow.

[fReDdArZ]

Getting ice wall to max level ends rogues 1hit wonders on ints/hybrids.
Chinese nukers never took this skill seriously and waste sp just for them.

Rogues can't kill a good chinese blader. That's a fact.

[CLOT]

I said can take the blader down in a second, i never said in 1 hit, of course, the next hit is enough to kill the blader.
And when you say the 95% of the time i imagine you are talking about a non blessed rogue (btw rogue/warlocks can take down bladers without easier than any other build imo). Even rogue/bards can kill bladers without much problems if they know when to attack, after all, rogue is based in surprisse attacks.
And for the record, i can kill bladers with xbow

only dagger wif DD on, posts a threat to blader, not xbow wif XE on

lol about the bless thing again, so if u bless and then DD, i will juz spam KD + snowshield + ironwall, my snowshield will last longer than bless (and better absorbing dmg wif 90cap 800mp, 6int)...so u gonna switch to cleric to heal when i spam KD? den wats the point lol, den we cant kill each other thats for sure

only when u wanna kill, thats the match point cuz when DD is on, u are taking a risk

warlock sub or chinese force builds are best 1v1 builds, no doubt about it, even blader lose 100% to warrior/warlock, let alone rogue/warlock, wiz/wralock, but holyspell ruins that sub totally

rogue/bard against blader? no chance lol if the blader is like 50% alert enouhg to KD when he see some 1 pricking

and surprised attack wif so many ppl using pk2?

are we talking abt job war/fw or 1v1 pvp here? lol if job war/fw, den the no. of ppl counts, not individual skills any more

if 1v1 pvp, how to have surprised attack? say "go" and then u invis and strike?


well all along i hv been talking about blader vs rogue/cleric 1v1 pvp not mass fights or something

[NobleHunter]

and surprised attack wif so many ppl using pk2?

I dont know how fckd up is your server but at least in mine just few people is using it, besides we are talking about a fair pvp not a haxord show.

[CLOT]

and surprised attack wif so many ppl using pk2?

I dont know how fckd up is your server but at least in mine just few people is using it, besides we are talking about a fair pvp not a haxord show.

so

rogue is based in surprisse attacks.

how to hv surprise attacks in a fair pvp?


maybe the bladers u vs. either sux in gear or sux in skill, cuz xbow can hardly get a blader's hp down below 2/3 (wif ironwall, snowshield, block, asssuming the blader does nothing to disable u)

[NobleHunter]

and surprised attack wif so many ppl using pk2?

I dont know how fckd up is your server but at least in mine just few people is using it, besides we are talking about a fair pvp not a haxord show.

so

rogue is based in surprisse attacks.

how to hv surprise attacks in a fair pvp?


maybe the bladers u vs. either sux in gear or sux in skill, cuz xbow can hardly get a blader's hp down below 2/3 (wif ironwall, snowshield, block, asssuming the blader does nothing to disable u)

With surprisse attacks im also talking about jobbing and wars, i know you cant attack like that at cape pvp and call it fair. And if the blader is not using those buffs you say, he can hardly survive. Distance shot > Hurricane shot KD > Intense Shot KB. If i can get them KD without his buffs they are pretty fckd, if the blader cast snowshield probably will kill me, but my chances are always good. Its not the best weapon to take a blader down but after i kill someone 3 times in a row with dagger skills they dont expect that kind of attack. And i can tell you the bladers i pvp (when im talking about pvp im talking specially about pvp at job) has at least +4 armor/accesory set and +5, +7 weapon/shield set.

[-.-]

hm... if blader uses snow shield, i dont see how rogue would lose that often :S

at 20% snow shield, he'll still take about 30% of damage to his mp, and rogues hit hard enough that it'll run his mp down to zero

[AWM]

Getting ice wall to max level ends rogues 1hit wonders on ints/hybrids.
Chinese nukers never took this skill seriously and waste sp just for them.

Rogues can't kill a good chinese blader. That's a fact.

+1

Sure rogue can kill too with super crits and no block, but what ive seen good bladers rape rogues anytime anyday.

[ahmedsabry]

I quit playing my rogue. I'm going to play a warrior. You will not get accepted into parties unless you have a Bard subclass or Cleric subclass. Though, you character will be terrible because your pure STR. In the end, bard and cleric is useless.

u dont need the stupid parties.. i grind on GENERALS with my level 68 Xbow (which is only +3, not full blues btw)

[CLOT]

hm... if blader uses snow shield, i dont see how rogue would lose that often :S

at 20% snow shield, he'll still take about 30% of damage to his mp, and rogues hit hard enough that it'll run his mp down to zero

i can take a rogue +6 dagger crit 24 wif 25% snowshield at 80 cap and still use skills
and 30% at 90 cap wif new int/mp blues

[ahmedsabry]

hm... if blader uses snow shield, i dont see how rogue would lose that often :S

at 20% snow shield, he'll still take about 30% of damage to his mp, and rogues hit hard enough that it'll run his mp down to zero

i can take a rogue +6 dagger crit 24 wif 25% snowshield at 80 cap and still use skills
and 30% at 90 cap wif new int/mp blues

true.. problem is they Dagger will prolly have u killed b4 u actually get to kill him. Even with DD on, i can still take a hit or two from SPEAR NUKERS and stay alive (i'm lv 69, equal level nukers do me 10-12k DMG with DD on while my HP is 13k, so with a pot+vigor+"recovery division" i get to survive the 1st hit-> pot-> survive the 2nd hit-> i would die to any other hit then but the nuker would be dead anyway)
also killing a blader with xbow alone isnt that hard man ..
a critical "distance shot" with a +5 xbow on a non "iron castle"ed blader does 20k+ damage.. not to mention KD + intense shot for 50% down attack DMG

[CLOT]

1. only pvp at cap is fair, every 1's gear are full blue and + to the max they can
pvp at any other level than cap is NOT a good/accurate judgement of how good a build is

at 80cap, i hv 20.5k hp, no prem, no avartar

i pvp loads of 80 full farmed xbow wif XE back then, even +9 xbow wif my +4 +5 gears...they simpy CANT kill me, max they hit is 13k crit on me

the only thing that can 1 hit me is wiz wif life control on, even +5 staff is enough to 1 hit blader (no snowshield)
22k on me wif no snow, 17k wif 25% snow

prick crit wif +5 +6 dagger cant 1 shot me either, 17-19k wif no snow and less wif snow

only chance rogue can kill me = dagger wif DD on, they always KD me wif xbow, use dagger do mortal wound --> me gets up, do a prick

usually wif 25% snow, after that mortal wound i would hv only ard 6-7k hp, 1/4 mp left...but aft i got up fr KD, i would hv do a ironwall and even a prick crit cant do shit to me ---> smart rogues turns bac to cleric to heal himself/xbow to cancel DD and continue KD me

thats wat almost 90% of the rogue i pvp wif do...if they dun cancel DD and still continue to hit me wif dagger after their prick, they are dead 100%

and xbow wif XE on are so easy to kill in 1v1

[ahmedsabry]

1. only pvp at cap is fair, every 1's gear are full blue and + to the max they can
pvp at any other level than cap is NOT a good/accurate judgement of how good a build is

at 80cap, i hv 20.5k hp, no prem, no avartar

i pvp loads of 80 full farmed xbow wif XE back then, even +9 xbow wif my +4 +5 gears...they simpy CANT kill me, max they hit is 13k crit on me

the only thing that can 1 hit me is wiz wif life control on, even +5 staff is enough to 1 hit blader (no snowshield)
22k on me wif no snow, 17k wif 25% snow

prick crit wif +5 +6 dagger cant 1 shot me either, 17-19k wif no snow and less wif snow

only chance rogue can kill me = dagger wif DD on, they always KD me wif xbow, use dagger do mortal wound --> me gets up, do a prick

usually wif 25% snow, after that mortal wound i would hv only ard 6-7k hp, 1/4 mp left...but aft i got up fr KD, i would hv do a ironwall and even a prick crit cant do shit to me ---> smart rogues turns bac to cleric to heal himself/xbow to cancel DD and continue KD me

thats wat almost 90% of the rogue i pvp wif do...if they dun cancel DD and still continue to hit me wif dagger after their prick, they are dead 100%

and xbow wif XE on are so easy to kill in 1v1

i cant actually argue about what happens on lv 80 cuz i havent tried it.. but why isnt pvp at this lv fair? remember that 70 was a cap one day.. my gear is pathetic too cuz i have a 6 lv (increasing it to 9) gap so my best gear piece is lv 62 and blues are FAR from full, cant say i do this because of my gear. anyway i have seen "Devil_IowU" do those 20k crits at the 80 cap in his video with only a +5 xbow:!:
ur also forgetting about something very important.. skill
a skilled blader (such as urself clot ) can only be compared to a skilled rogue. all botted or powerfarmed rogues just use either dagger or xbow in a certain fight, but only skilled rogues cobine them..
i take down warriors my level with thier iron skin ON! goes like this: xbow on without XE-> hurricane shot to kd-> dagger on -> DD -> mortal wounds -> prick.
trust me.. a Mortal with DD on a KDed opponent IS devastating.. but nobody uses this combo because it takes skill and very fast reaction to perform (u need to use the xbow kd and see if the opponent is KDed or not, then switch to dags and DD in a fraction of a second so u can hit all three mortal wounds b4 the opponent gets up to ensure the kill)

[mkzr]

6 lvl 90full farmed clerics ready with bless n stuff, 1 lvl 90 warrior with screens and a lvl 90 full farmed wizard with full sun+9 gear including his staff with over 3.8k mag. attack. all in same party, will win vs a rogue

[CLOT]

xbow on without XE-> hurricane shot to kd-> dagger on -> DD -> mortal wounds -> prick.
trust me.. a Mortal with DD on a KDed opponent IS devastating.. but nobody uses this combo because it takes skill and very fast reaction to perform

lol almost all the rogue i pvp wif do exactly like this, i mentioned this in my previous post too
but of coz there are another 50% skill-less rogue that i can kill w/o snow/ironwall, i dun even bother talking about these ppl cuz i dun even waste my time pvp wif them

such as urself clot

well, if any 1 plays on mercury, they know that SuperSkank is a pro blader, (along with me )

anywayz, i juz found blader amazing at 90 cap
i could kill 90 str glaive wif my 85 skills within 10 hits with that amazing shield pd skill

and i could tank so well, it took 15-20 80+ ppl to take me down in fw as i ran across enemy's ress point killing low levels and playing hide and seek with the other high levels xD

[ahmedsabry]

anywayz, i juz found blader amazing at 90 cap
i could kill 90 str glaive wif my 85 skills within 10 hits with that amazing shield pd skill

and i could tank so well, it took 15-20 80+ ppl to take me down in fw as i ran across enemy's ress point killing low levels and playing hide and seek with the other high levels xD

so the new blade skillz do make a difference dont they?
people kept yelling about how useless they'd be b4 the update
anyway, i guess those retards i keep owning are blader disgrace.. i havent even dlvled my bard for cleric yet, and i take them down pretty much with ease (aside from that sun blader guy who keeps kicking everyone's butt in CTF :S). i remember that one time in the event when the opponent team was spawn-killing us and i got 30 tickets.. they had two bladers on thier team who did absolutely nothing other than hitting me with all those 300 dmg hits and watching me as i kill thier nukers
u'll still lose to me if u came to sparta (and i reached the cap )..

[Jaapii]

Who said there that a critical rogue attack damages less than a wizard nuke?!
Crit Prick + a combo = Deadly as hell.. no one survives this, only good bladers and 1h warriors need the combo though.
And a crit prick is always more then a wizard nuke, just becuz almost everyone uses garment, robe these days, except warriors and rogues.

[NobleHunter]

And a crit prick is always more then a wizard nuke, just becuz almost everyone uses garment, robe these days, except warriors and rogues.

Not only a prick crit, a distance shot crit too. Rogues with high crit weapons can ks mobs from wizards very easy.

[CLOT]

even in garm, prick crit wif DD will be abit less dmg than fire meteor wif life control on, given same +5 weap

xbow crit wif XE cant be euqal to or even more than fire metor wif life control on wif same weap + , rofl

as i said, 80 cap bac theni tested alot of times,
fire meteor wif life control = 22-23k, prick crit = ard 18~19k, xbow crit = less than 15k

all done on me w/o snowshield, w/o ironwall...juz normal blader buffs at 80 cap

anywayz, i juz found blader amazing at 90 cap
i could kill 90 str glaive wif my 85 skills within 10 hits with that amazing shield pd skill

and i could tank so well, it took 15-20 80+ ppl to take me down in fw as i ran across enemy's ress point killing low levels and playing hide and seek with the other high levels xD

so the new blade skillz do make a difference dont they?
people kept yelling about how useless they'd be b4 the update
anyway, i guess those retards i keep owning are blader disgrace.. i havent even dlvled my bard for cleric yet, and i take them down pretty much with ease (aside from that sun blader guy who keeps kicking everyone's butt in CTF :S). i remember that one time in the event when the opponent team was spawn-killing us and i got 30 tickets.. they had two bladers on thier team who did absolutely nothing other than hitting me with all those 300 dmg hits and watching me as i kill thier nukers
u'll still lose to me if u came to sparta (and i reached the cap )..

lol i am 89 for long time already, need some 90k sp for 90 full farmed, so i juz keep skill 85 and do some 5 gap farming along the way to 90 99%

and that shield skill adds 111 phy attack power atm (not max yet, i think 2 more level from 85-90)...wif my +7 blade and +7 shield, my blade is gonna become like +10? or even +11

well i hv extra skill to pwn chinese nuker in snowshield/str glaivers now, which were unpwnable in 80 cap

[hemagoku]

And a crit prick is always more then a wizard nuke, just becuz almost everyone uses garment, robe these days, except warriors and rogues.

Not only a prick crit, a distance shot crit too. Rogues with high crit weapons can ks mobs from wizards very easy.

not if wiz puts on life control ,dagger need time to go mob ,and wiz don't ,but a crossbow can i guess ,btw me and friend killed a 80+ rogue yesterday ,my friend was cleric /warlock ,buffed me and debuffed him ,and yup we killed him ,also we killed a blader ,but in 8d not 9d ,so if u pvp party u can win against anyone if u have good party pvp XD it was nice till we went event then it was bugged

[link2113]

ok rouges. Ive Pvped With alot of rouges, Btw im a 2h Warrior, if they attk u 1st no its not a guaranteed win. For some reason ppl think rouges are the best class, there not. Ok the thing that pisses me off about rouges is that they go invisible and they do that freaking over powered stab to the kidneys thing which rapes you. And when they don't kill u with that they run to safe zones. And another thing that pisses me off is that their weapons mostly have 20 critical holt shit that like every other hit they hit a crit. But hehehehe, just wait rouges when i get daredevil u better watch the exterminator is coming to town lol. But hey rouges are prett powerful im not calling em weak its just cmon 20 critical? Lol

[John_Doe]

speaking of stealth no being considered fair, in a fair fight, I believe it just a matter of opion, they made rogues and wizards invisiable yes, but they give us pills to counter it, so if your complaining about the skill, it's as much of a "cheat skill" as mana shield, iron skin, bless...etc. When fighting or "duel" you should agrue on "steath" though with both parties.

[CLOT]

ok rouges. Ive Pvped With alot of rouges, Btw im a 2h Warrior, if they attk u 1st no its not a guaranteed win. For some reason ppl think rouges are the best class, there not. Ok the thing that pisses me off about rouges is that they go invisible and they do that freaking over powered stab to the kidneys thing which rapes you. And when they don't kill u with that they run to safe zones. And another thing that pisses me off is that their weapons mostly have 20 critical holt shit that like every other hit they hit a crit. But hehehehe, just wait rouges when i get daredevil u better watch the exterminator is coming to town lol. But hey rouges are prett powerful im not calling em weak its just cmon 20 critical? Lol

thats the "prick" we hv been talking about above

speaking of stealth no being considered fair, in a fair fight, I believe it just a matter of opion, they made rogues and wizards invisiable yes, but they give us pills to counter it, so if your complaining about the skill, it's as much of a "cheat skill" as mana shield, iron skin, bless...etc. When fighting or "duel" you should agrue on "steath" though with both parties.

i didnt complain about it
i'm juz asking how do u use invis when u are in 1v1 pvp wif some 1

say "go" den u go invis and try to do attack in surprise?
u know when u click on rogue/wiz b4 they go invis, u can still attack them after they use invis...its not pk2 bug, its an sro game bug...so how do u hv a fair pvp then?

and nukers could simply cast a huge icewall (lvl90 ice wall has 13.5k hp) and wait for rogue to attack in 1v1

[Marth690]

All builds can kill em its all about getting first hit. the first hit usually determines the outcome of the match.

Int based chars can loose easily to rouges but its still situational