wizard, sub-class bard

AC · Post by AC » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:02 pm

ok i finally agreed with mafa, i see no use in cleric as being a sub-class because they're party buffs.. (forget other ppl), and bards are self-buffs so i totally agree.

so, im just wondering what skills to get for bard as a sub-class and how much lvls lower should it be from my main class (wizard).

TY

Goobronicus · Post by **Goobronicus** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:08 pm

What skills: Noise (attack prevention) and Moving/Swing March(Speeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed!)

What level should your mastery be? These skills come every ten levels; with noise being 10 levels higher than it's base level. For instance, Noise for level 50 mastery works for level 60 mobs. In essence, your bard mastery should be a multiple of 10 (10,20,30,40,50,60,70,80). So whatever gap you want to play with your main class, keep your bard within that boundary. For instance if you wanted to play a 3 gap and you are level 52, you'd have a bard mastery of 40 (or at most 49 if you didn't want to spend all your sp to get 10 levels of bard) and your wizard mastery would be 49.

Hope this helps. Wiz/Bard is the best PVE build, however Wiz/Cleric is probably the best PVP build of the Wizard subclasses (due to extra defense). In life turnover we are still a one shot though

. GO ASSASSINS!

*This comes from the mouth of a level 80 wizard/ 80 bard; so you can bet that I've had experience playing my classes

.

ThisIsAvalon · Post by **ThisIsAvalon** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:10 pm

Lol, recovery divison alone makes cleric sub the best to pick.

I personally like warlock sub... Why?

Goobronicus · Post by **Goobronicus** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:11 pm

ThisIsAvalon wrote:Lol, recovery divison alone makes cleric sub the best to pick.

I personally like warlock sub... Why?

Unless you want to be slow as h3ll and buying Drugs of Wind/Typhoon all the time. LOLZ!

My guess is you like the warlock sub because of stun/sleep/division/bleed etc, which then allows you to switch weapons and pulverize them

.

MrBow · Post by **MrBow** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:12 pm

ThisIsAvalon wrote:Lol, recovery divison alone makes cleric sub the best to pick.

I personally like warlock sub... Why?

pffft you'll be as slow as a snail
(pve) = bard > cleric

donkyle · Post by **donkyle** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:12 pm

what does recovery divison do ?

Renton · Post by **Renton** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:13 pm

Goobronicus wrote:
ThisIsAvalon wrote:Lol, recovery divison alone makes cleric sub the best to pick.

I personally like warlock sub... Why?

Unless you want to be slow as h3ll and buying Drugs of Wind/Typhoon all the time. LOLZ!

My guess is you like the warlock sub because of stun/sleep/division/bleed etc, which then allows you to switch weapons and pulverize them .

Event scrolls.. plenty of them out there.

Goobronicus · Post by **Goobronicus** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:13 pm

50% movement vs. my 90% movement? I'll take 90%

(My party mates like the 90% movement as well, since it is a party buff)

ShadowSpell · Post by **ShadowSpell** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:17 pm

im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

iGod · Post by **iGod** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:18 pm

AC wrote:ok i finally agreed with mafa, i see no use in cleric as being a sub-class because they're party buffs.. (forget other ppl), and bards are self-buffs so i totally agree.

so, im just wondering what skills to get for bard as a sub-class and how much lvls lower should it be from my main class (wizard).

TY

You can live with it being 10 levels lower than wizard really... You'll be good with noise/swing march at 70 at 80 cap.

donkyle · Post by **donkyle** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:33 pm

soulreapr wrote:im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

can you tell me what recovery divison does?

ShadowSpell · Post by **ShadowSpell** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:53 pm

donkyle wrote:
soulreapr wrote:im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

can you tell me what recovery divison does?

auto heals you about every 5-10 seconds for the ammount stated on the lvl of buff you have, mine is like 1200

donkyle · Post by **donkyle** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:55 pm

soulreapr wrote:
donkyle wrote:
soulreapr wrote:im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

can you tell me what recovery divison does?

auto heals you about every 5-10 seconds for the ammount stated on the lvl of buff you have, mine is like 1200

nicee i never knew is did that or i would have got it

mafa · Post by **mafa** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:51 pm

I find bard way more usefull than cleric, good choice AC.

Cleric might be able to tank a little more, but whats the point since you 1 hit every mob there is, giants might kill you but you can always grind at niya royals/snipers/bone soldiers and karras (since karras are damn weak) and lets not forget about dances, chinese players will be begging to have you in their pt for 34% mg increase or 30% phy increase. If i knew any +70lv bards with my chinese character i would plevel them for free all the time and enjoy 34% mg increase + 90% movement speed.

blackh4t · Post by **blackh4t** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:36 pm

soulreapr wrote:im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

So how does Cleric Subb helps ?! You can kill Wizz with one skill eventually two with or withouth ... Right ?

mafa · Post by **mafa** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:44 pm

soulreapr wrote:im a lvl 79 wizard with cleric subclass, and unless the only thing your looking for is speed and noise bard has nothing else for you. Cleric does have 3 skills that help you that you can have on while grinding, plus you can heal yourself. What good does noise do for you anyways, when you get to high lvls your not trying to keep mobs away, your trying to find more and a wizard at lvl 72 with 72 skills 1 hits niya generals and you spend more time looking for them then worrying about keeping them away. GO CLERIC wizards can really use a buff that gives you like 800phy def increase and 1600 mag defence increase, plus your immune to effects like freeze and you have recovery division.

Didnt see your msg there, noise is great for unique hunting like yarkan, theres several partys + alot party mobs running araund, wouldnt you die with out noise if 5 party hunters/royals/mages/bone soldiers attacked you ? 90% movement speed saves you time and money, you dont need 60lv horses since you can out run them, matter of fact, you dont need horses at all.

What about that 34% mg increase buff ? Your party might actually get the kill becouse of it.

Shorty, if you like uniques, bard is your best friend.

ShadowSpell · Post by **ShadowSpell** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:07 pm

if you like pvp and jobbing, cleric is your best friend and thats what I like

SoBlu · Post by **SoBlu** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:35 pm

all preference, you can just abuse horses if you go cleric.

If you play with ppl alot, then go Cleric. If your more solo/amateur then go bard.

personally I think bard is under rated and the least used trees besides for use with noise/swing march.

half the skills in bard that are good take 2 to tango, it makes it quite obvious bard is a tree meant to be abused and used by many to get the buffs.
go bard, be legendary.

TheInstinct · Post by **TheInstinct** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:47 pm

Which Bard buffs stay after switching out of the harp?

Goobronicus · Post by **Goobronicus** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:06 am

None, except the two I mentioned. The others require "two to tango" as the above person mentioned. Huge damage buffs, better healing, physical or magical absorption; bards have great buffs but they require at least two bards to be in party.

TheInstinct · Post by **TheInstinct** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:12 am

So, to clarify, only Noise buff(Aggressive Prevention) and the Speed buff stay? Seems like a waste of a sub-class.

Goobronicus · Post by **Goobronicus** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:23 am

TheInstinct wrote:So, to clarify, only Noise buff(Aggressive Prevention) and the Speed buff stay? Seems like a waste of a sub-class.

Waste of a subclass maybe, but makes the best PVE build in the game. You move the fastest (unless someone buys a drug of typhoon), you aren't attacked by any mobs you don't want to be attacked by (party royal guards aren't much fun), and you hit the hardest in the game because of your main class. Waste of a subclass to some, but it made me level to 80 faster than any euro botter did in Rome; and most of all, I enjoyed it. My speed makes it so I get to mobs the fastest, and my damage makes it so I can't be ks'd

. Win/win situation for me.

Crumpets · Post by **Crumpets** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:33 am

BARD > CLERIC

Why? One word. Noise.

That buff helps so god damn much. Trying to spawn a horse, pvp cape, job cape, running throught area's that would easily get you killed.

Beautiful.

Combine it with wizard's invisibility = Ninja attacks. KEKEKE

skandal · Post by **skandal** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:01 am

Bard sub-class for wizzard is useless...i speak out of experience...yah you might get that 60-70-80% moving speed, and your noise buff, which is in itself useless against champs/giant's but the only thing you can do with bard in pvp is sit and buff...plus dances...well till u find another bard it would take awhile...eh...cleric has bless, recovery division, int/str buffs(not for yourself tho)...i find cleric to be a better class for soloing than bard...not to mention : LIGHT ARMOR. 2 words that mean more than the whole stuff bard could provide u. IMO bard is a bad choice and ima delevel it myself and get cleric.damn, 44 lvls of mastery...gay

trein91 · Post by **trein91** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:05 pm

skandal wrote:Bard sub-class for wizzard is useless...i speak out of experience...yah you might get that 60-70-80% moving speed, and your noise buff, which is in itself useless against champs/giant's but the only thing you can do with bard in pvp is sit and buff...plus dances...well till u find another bard it would take awhile...eh...cleric has bless, recovery division, int/str buffs(not for yourself tho)...i find cleric to be a better class for soloing than bard...not to mention : LIGHT ARMOR. 2 words that mean more than the whole stuff bard could provide u. IMO bard is a bad choice and ima delevel it myself and get cleric.damn, 44 lvls of mastery...gay

Same here. I was wizard cleric with lvl 70 + Wizard and Lvl 70 Bard. I delvled my Bard Mastery and switched to Cleric mainly because very few actually appreciate it. Besides, bards aren't of much use when your the only one in the party. Furthermore, full euro parties are scarce in iSRO, so there won't be any point for bards to heal mp.

Crumpets · Post by **Crumpets** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:44 pm

skandal wrote:Bard sub-class for wizzard is useless...i speak out of experience...yah you might get that 60-70-80% moving speed, and your noise buff, which is in itself useless against champs/giant's but the only thing you can do with bard in pvp is sit and buff...plus dances...well till u find another bard it would take awhile...eh...cleric has bless, recovery division, int/str buffs(not for yourself tho)...i find cleric to be a better class for soloing than bard...not to mention : LIGHT ARMOR. 2 words that mean more than the whole stuff bard could provide u. IMO bard is a bad choice and ima delevel it myself and get cleric.damn, 44 lvls of mastery...gay

What does armor type matter when your a 1 hit to anyone if you got lifeforce on anyway ? - -!!

Bless / recovery division / nt str all good buffs I agree. But 8 out of 10 euro's have a cleric sub or main. On my 68 Cleric I was left doing **** all cause everyone was allready fully buffed in wars. All I was, was another buffer.

Yet Bard .. it's nice to have speed, it's nice to not be attacked by mobs. Oh and the dances are extra nice. For a job war example ... just go afk in the gate while either dancing with another bard for ultrade defense / attack or solo for defense.

For me, even tho you pointed out strong points for a cleric .... for me it's still BARD > CLERIC.

Aby · Post by **Aby** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:53 pm

He thinks cleric is a bad subclassLOL

Esecially for wizard..

Yeah speed + aggro resistance > better armor, better def, better pvp, the ability to kill giants..

Obviously tho

Crumpets · Post by **Crumpets** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:58 pm

Aby wrote:He thinks cleric is a bad subclassLOL

Esecially for wizard..

Yeah speed + aggro resistance > better armor, better def, better pvp, the ability to kill giants..

Obviously tho

Aby has a lvl 72+ wiz?

Nah didn't think so. Let me break it down for you.

Armor + def = Same thing. Understand right? Not hard to comprehend yet. Now, to hit high, you want to be using life force. Using life force makes every wizard regardless of ARMOR TYPE a 1 or 2 hit. So gg to your unexperienced theory.

Better pvp? Nah don't think so.

Giants? I do fine WITH life force and no sub cleric vs a Giant Sniper.

People Like Aby should seriously go make a Wizard, lvl it past 16 and then provide a theory. Hell maby even hand grind it huh.

Even know ANYTHING at all about wizards ?

ShadowSpell · Post by **ShadowSpell** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:14 pm

Crumpets wrote:
Aby wrote:He thinks cleric is a bad subclassLOL

Esecially for wizard..

Yeah speed + aggro resistance > better armor, better def, better pvp, the ability to kill giants..

Obviously tho

Aby has a lvl 72+ wiz?

Nah didn't think so. Let me break it down for you.

Armor + def = Same thing. Understand right? Not hard to comprehend yet. Now, to hit high, you want to be using life force. Using life force makes every wizard regardless of ARMOR TYPE a 1 or 2 hit. So gg to your unexperienced theory.

Better pvp? Nah don't think so.

Giants? I do fine WITH life force and no sub cleric vs a Giant Sniper.

People Like Aby should seriously go make a Wizard, lvl it past 16 and then provide a theory. Hell maby even hand grind it huh.

Even know ANYTHING at all about wizards ?

so what your saying is having a buff that increases your phy defence by 900 and your mag defence by 1600 is pointless?, when im jobbing or pvping and have that one and then put on earth barrier I can withstand a ss emperor, mars, and a ss soul, yep and also a skill that takes away abnormal status, and then one that auto heals you are useless, and again I will say it, what good is noise, you must be one of the only people that I know that is trying to keep lvl 75+ mobs away from you, I have a hard enough time finding enough of them considering the whole area is over ran with bots.

shoto · Post by **shoto** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:25 pm

lol good point.

Bard is mostly a convenience build. All the useful skills it possess as a sub build are there for covenience. More speed for ease of movement. And the non aggro...which i guess is useful if you are getting plvl'ed??

anways, i think Bard is not a bad sub class, just that cleric is better. If you take cleric a decent way in...even into just the 50's/60's you'll see just how useful it is.

Again, the Bard speed boost can be made up by drugs and if you can't afford drugs at 80 then i guess you can buy the cheapo scrolls.

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