??????? Bug Worse Than Ever, and so are the crit tablets.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:35 am

Today I was DCed no less than 13 times,..every time getting the ??????? error. Kind of sick of that crap. In the middle of quests, the middle of giant killing, the middle of merchanting, the middle of grinding,..so lame. Then it takes 30 minutes to log back in. WTF. The ????? errors and horrible lag are ruining this game. I wish they would ever do something about it.

Oh yah, and Im up to 46 crit tablets used,..not one worked. It has to be bugged because the text on the tabs says "resets the value and adds a NEW value". Re-rolling the same number is not a new value, the value is the same damn one.

Game full of bugs,...its getting stupid real fast.

cuchulainn · Post by **cuchulainn** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:37 am

PigDestroyer wrote:Oh yah, and Im up to 46 crit tablets used,..not one worked. It has to be bugged because the text on the tabs says "resets the value and adds a NEW value. Re-rolling the same number is not a new value, the value is the same damn one.

Crit tablets:

Your crit is say "2"

The stone wipes it. Now it's " "

Then adds a new value, which happens to be "2"

Chief · Post by **Chief** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:38 am

i never get the ?????? error

. but my graphic card is 32mb... i have to set everything to low or 1

.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:40 am

well to me a NEW value means something other than the value already there, whether its higher or lower,..dont matter just a NEW value. If it is possible to stay the same the text should say, "adds a NEW value or you keep the same damn value and your shit out of luck"

Silkroad Help · Post by **Silkroad Help** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:41 am

I've had this error a few times, but not 13 times in a short amount of time

It is very annoying though :banghead:

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 4:42 am

Chief wrote:i never get the ?????? error . but my graphic card is 32mb... i have to set everything to low or 1 .

my graphics card is 128mb so.... i dont think that thats the problem, obviously.

element_45 · Post by **element_45** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:13 am

PigDestroyer wrote:well to me a NEW value means something other than the value already there, whether its higher or lower,..dont matter just a NEW value.

Well, then unfortunately you and the game have two different views on the subject.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:46 am

element_45 wrote:
PigDestroyer wrote:well to me a NEW value means something other than the value already there, whether its higher or lower,..dont matter just a NEW value.

Well, then unfortunately you and the game have two different views on the subject.

OK, I guess I have to put this in a way that the kids can understand,.. If a math teacher wrote the number "5" on the chalkboard, and then asked, "what is this number?", a student would most likely raise his/her hand and say, "well,... that's the number five". Now, the math teacher asks the stundent to give him/her a NEW value other than the number he/she just wrote. Its pretty safe to say if you answered him/her by saying, "umm,..5?" you would get some pretty stupid looks (even from the underachievers who sit in the back corner and wad spitballs all day). See where I'm gettin' at? I'm pretty sure that if asked for a NEW value other than the one already there,...99.99% of the students would give a number other than 5, (i.e. 99.99% of the students would make a safe assumption that the teacher wasn't asking for some smart ass to give him/her the same damn number).

cuchulainn · Post by **cuchulainn** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 5:53 am

PigDestroyer wrote:
element_45 wrote:
PigDestroyer wrote:well to me a NEW value means something other than the value already there, whether its higher or lower,..dont matter just a NEW value.

Well, then unfortunately you and the game have two different views on the subject.

OK, I guess I have to put this in a way that the kids can understand,.. If a math teacher wrote the number "5" on the chalkboard, and then asked, "what is this number?", a student would most likely raise his/her hand and say, "well,... that's the number five". Now, the math teacher asks the stundent to give him/her a NEW value other than the number he/she just wrote. Its pretty safe to say if you answered him/her by saying, "umm,..5?" you would get some pretty stupid looks (even from the underachievers who sit in the back corner and wad spitballs all day). See where I'm gettin' at? I'm pretty sure that if asked for a NEW value other than the one already there,...99.99% of the students would give a number other than 5, (i.e. 99.99% of the students would make a safe assumption that the teacher wasn't asking for some smart ass to give him/her the same damn number).

This isn't school, it's SRO, you don't dictate what things in game do, the developers do.

doplertin · Post by **doplertin** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:13 am

when we play sro we are playing in a totally different world

it doesnt work the same way we are used to or brought up being used to

it is a game ported from a totally different background. thats why its iSRO. in fact most of the great games of that type are never brought to our side.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:18 am

cuchulainn wrote:
PigDestroyer wrote:
element_45 wrote:
PigDestroyer wrote:well to me a NEW value means something other than the value already there, whether its higher or lower,..dont matter just a NEW value.

Well, then unfortunately you and the game have two different views on the subject.

OK, I guess I have to put this in a way that the kids can understand,.. If a math teacher wrote the number "5" on the chalkboard, and then asked, "what is this number?", a student would most likely raise his/her hand and say, "well,... that's the number five". Now, the math teacher asks the stundent to give him/her a NEW value other than the number he/she just wrote. Its pretty safe to say if you answered him/her by saying, "umm,..5?" you would get some pretty stupid looks (even from the underachievers who sit in the back corner and wad spitballs all day). See where I'm gettin' at? I'm pretty sure that if asked for a NEW value other than the one already there,...99.99% of the students would give a number other than 5, (i.e. 99.99% of the students would make a safe assumption that the teacher wasn't asking for some smart ass to give him/her the same damn number).

This isn't school, it's SRO, you don't dictate what things in game do, the developers do.

Dude, I think you know the point I'm trying to get across, and that is - By the text saying that the tablet will reset the number to a new value, they are making gamers assume that they are not going to get the same exact number. And 25 times? (46 = 25 were a so called "success" but the same number, and 21 failed) I'm pretty sure that's not just unlucky, but if you say so...

A BUG is what that is. Period.

cuchulainn · Post by **cuchulainn** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:32 am

No, it's a bad translation. Those abound in the game, but the gamers learn and make their peers aware of it.

If you feel it's a bug, report it, that's what the bug report is for.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:37 am

cuchulainn wrote:If you feel it's a bug, report it, that's what the bug report is for.

And you can bet your ass that's what I'm going to do,...not that it will accomplish much.

I just wanted to know how other players feel about it,..whether or not they to think some of the tabs might be bugged (not only because of the same exact number crap, but the horrible rate of success and actual probability of rolling a DIFFERENT number). Or like Cuch says, "it just happens to be the same number". But 25 times it happens to be the same? C'mon.

aznshadow · Post by **aznshadow** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:50 am

Wow actually worse then me

8 Crit Tablets = Failed
9th = Crit changed from 5 to 5
Gave up after 9th cuz well... reached 60... able to use my +3 lvl 60 Glaive CRIT 11

Kew · Post by **Kew** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:51 am

the point is, it doesnt add a new value, it rerolls the number. like a dice.
it must be like with every other aspect of alchemy. its harder to get higher values, since those make the item stronger, thus they should be harder to archive.
first it erases the crit, then it rolls a new one. wich is most probably a low one, since chances are higher to get a low number.

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 6:55 am

Kew wrote:the point is, it doesnt add a new value, it rerolls the number. like a dice.
it must be like with every other aspect of alchemy. its harder to get higher values, since those make the item stronger, thus they should be harder to archive.
first it erases the crit, then i rolls a new one. wich is most probably a low one, since chances are higher to get a low number.

Again, my point is, how can it do this "same number" crap so many times? 25 times and not even a lower number except for the very first roll which set it to that infamous number. Do you understand now? At the rate it's going there is no other possible number (other than the same one) in sight.

Irukandji · Post by **Irukandji** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:00 am

its just bad luck - my brother did crit stones on his glaive. It went for 3-2-2-2-etc. and on the last stone it went from 2-12. Its just luck, no bug.

Kew · Post by **Kew** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:02 am

yes yes, i do understand
the problem is, my english is not enough to explain what i would like to say, so i wont try

on countless alchemy attempts i got the same value as the item had before. from 1-2 str to the same 1-2 str. 3% ice resist to 3% ice resist ect ect. ok, from what i hear crit and br stones are worse then the others

PigDestroyer · Post by **PigDestroyer** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:10 am

Irukandji wrote:its just bad luck - my brother did crit stones on his glaive. It went for 3-2-2-2-etc. and on the last stone it went from 2-12. Its just luck, no bug.

Even if it wasn't bugged - or somewhat bugged, why would the developers want to make it so re-rolling a different number would be like winning the figgen' powerball. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not talkin' about a higher number, I could understand that,...I'm just talkin' about a different number. I'm trying to understand, but it's hard.

Also, why do players continue to sell them for OUTRAGEOUS prices even though the chances of them succeeding are so minute? Thats kind of stupid as well. Makes about as much sense as a 5-pack of beer.

Mister_Eric · Post by **Mister_Eric** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:12 am

i barley get the ??? error anymore ^^ only went i afk stall

DragonTalon · Post by **DragonTalon** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:41 am

PigDestroyer wrote:Today I was DCed no less than 13 times,..every time getting the ??????? error. Kind of sick of that crap. In the middle of quests, the middle of giant killing, the middle of merchanting, the middle of grinding,..so lame. Then it takes 30 minutes to log back in. WTF. The ????? errors and horrible lag are ruining this game. I wish they would ever do something about it.

Oh yah, and Im up to 46 crit tablets used,..not one worked. It has to be bugged because the text on the tabs says "resets the value and adds a NEW value". Re-rolling the same number is not a new value, the value is the same damn one.

Game full of bugs,...its getting stupid real fast.

My thoughts EXACTLY except i dont get ??? that much anymore ive been getting the dc message

klaus · Post by **klaus** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 2:47 pm

my friend used one crit tablet on a glaive
2->14

Doru · Post by **Doru** » Sat Jul 29, 2006 7:58 pm

PigDestroyer wrote:Again, my point is, how can it do this "same number" crap so many times?

Two reasons:

1. Because you're trying to alchemize an item that has a low chance of success when being alchemized. It says right in the alchemy help menu "each item has a percentage of probability of success". IMO, this applies to all alchemy done on the item, whether it be through tablets or elixirs. I take this to mean that each item has a hidden value which dictates how easily it can be enhanced.

IME, this has proven to be true, as items that went to (at least) +3 on the first or second try also have had a rather high success rate when alchemizing via tablets/stones, and vice versa. Of course, there is always a chance that a high success rate item will fail, and a low success rate item will succeed, so you need to view results over an extended period of time and not based off a limited number of attempts. It appears to me the weapon you're trying to raise the crit on has a low success rate - I'd be interested in knowing if you have tried any other alchemy on it and what the results were. (I should also mention that lately I've had unexplained success on difficult items by changing my location).

2. Critical is arguably the most important stat on physical weapons, much like mag attack % is on magical weapons. The game devs know this, so of course they are going to make it hard to get not only a good value, but perhaps even a decent one. It doesn't make sense to allow the most important attributes on your weapon to be changed for the better so easily - everyone would do it, weapons with high crit or mag. attack % would become the norm, and thus they would lose their importance because everyone would have it. Having a low success rate on raising crit & mag attack % keeps balance in the game.

So, having a low success rate on raising crit on a weapon that appears to have a really low probability for success = very, very low chance for success.

Either that or you're just one unlucky mofo.

pingpongboss · Post by **pingpongboss** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:24 am

wow doru, well said

zelzin · Post by **zelzin** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 11:18 am

That's a really fair poll.

Geobot · Post by **Geobot** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:33 pm

As for the ??? error, i have a few choice words to say about that also. most of them however, are not the kind of words i like to use on a public forum.

but seriously, i just started playing again a week ago after being gone for 2-3 months. before, i would get that error MAYBE once every couple days. also, the lag back then was horrible for me, not just in town, but out fighting also.

since i started back though, i haven't been lagging AT ALL in the field, and WAY less in town. "what's bad about that" you ask? well, simply put, i get the stupid ???? error about 10 times a day now. my wife, who happens to play on the computer three feet from mine, also gets crashed alot. sometimes at the same time, most often not. a friend who happens to be leveling near me often crashes at the same time i do.

now, i haven't changed my computer settings, hell, i hardly used my pc at all during those two months, so don't tell me it's outdated drivers, or something wrong with my video card, because i KNOW it's not.

another odd thing to note..... last night i started a new char. and so far, i haven't crashed out all night. my wife was even able to keep her game running on HER new char to stall. and it's still going, 6 hours later. on our old characters, my stalls were never open when i woke up, and i'd have the joy of seeing a box full of crap on my desktop each and every morning.

so why would the new characters not crash? simple, because we're still in jangan. on my old char, i never crashed on the jangan side of the ferry while doing trade runs, etc. my new char hasn't been to DW yet, and has yet to crash.

so what does this mean? IMHO, it reduces lag where it sees it. whether this is an intentional act by joymax, or (and more likely) just a bug to be worked out, it seems like it crashes alot of people in the same area at the same time. the reason it crashes more in DW is simply because there are more people crammed in there than anywhere else in the game. this makes the whole zone(not just the town itself) unstable. comparatively, jangan and hotan are much less crowded, and thus the problem doesn't happen much.

so, if i have to take my choice of horrendous lag or getting booted 10 times a day, which is the lesser of two evils? at this point, i'm really not sure, because both of them are hard to deal with. if i HAD to choose though, i'd take the DCs. at least when you ARE playing, you can actually play, instead of *click*wait*click*die*

[SD]Master_Wong · Post by **[SD]Master_Wong** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:38 pm

is this not like elixirs?

just chance i got something from crit 4-2-7 im happy

Cheopsje · Post by **Cheopsje** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 4:43 pm

I used many tablets, and I think a good 60% of them worked, so considering some people havn't even gotten one single tablet to work I am avery happy preson

ViolentFemme · Post by **ViolentFemme** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:51 am

Cheopsje wrote:I used many tablets, and I think a good 60% of them worked, so considering some people havn't even gotten one single tablet to work I am avery happy preson

me too...I think anytime a person tries to blame on code what is essentially luck... I laugh at them.

Its like you have all the lottery numbers off by one..and then you go "BUG! the lottery system is bugged!"

42-16-35-....ummm....only in Lost can you say that..cause those are some freakishly bugged numbers....you know causing glitches in the operating system of reality.

regardless...that poll too..heh...talk about biased.

Tun_Teja · Post by **Tun_Teja** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:25 am

off topic: guys, i need confirmation. if i add astral & immortal on my weapon, the +++ thingy shouldnt become 0 if the alchemy fail izzit. If yes, how come it reset my sos spear back to +0 when its fail??... im really piss off wasting a lot of elixir & silk. plz make me calm

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??????? Bug Worse Than Ever, and so are the crit tablets.

Do you believe some of the alchemy tablets, and/or stones are bugged?

??????? Bug Worse Than Ever, and so are the crit tablets.

Re: ??????? Bug Worse Than Ever

Re: ??????? Bug Worse Than Ever, and so are the crit tablets