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The Joker wrote:Priam,

if I'm not mistaken you are Dutch.

Try this link.

Excerpt wrote:“... if every human being who ever lived had devoted his or her entire life to attempting to make sharpened pencils stand on end, it would be highly unlikely that even one pencil would have stood up for six seconds. Of course, you may have somewhat better luck if the points of your pencils become slightly worn.” (Lorenz,
The Essence of Chaos, 22)

In theory this pencil could remain vertical forever, if it was positioned in equilibrium, but
we are far from being able to determine the difference between a pencil that is truly vertical
and one that is slightly tilted. Lorenz adds that the mathematical chance for us to pick the
exact vertical state among infinitely many vertical near states is zero, and even if unstable
equilibrium was achieved in the real world, something would soon disturb it. But Lorenz says
that chaotic systems may possess states of equilibrium that are unstable. Certainly we can see
how unstable equilibrium and sensitive dependence are similar in the regard they involve the
‘amplification of initially small differences.’

Grandpa wrote:Check out the origin of what is known as "The Butterfly Effect"
It goes back to 1960 when Edward Lorenz took a shortcut with a computer model.
The word "Chaos" is derived from Greek Philosophers when they tried to describe the universe before matter. Interesting stuff.

Feel free to quote points of interest you stumble upon. I'll be reading more as we go.

What happens when the clock runs down? (Chaos Theory)

Friedrich Nietzsche, one of the first philosophers to completely reject modernity, understood the end of this pursuit was nihilism. The quest for a perfect system of knowledge would collapse on itself. In his words: "There are no facts, only interpretations." Nothing we can place our faith in, except maybe the creation of our pursuit. But this creation is a beast. Like Frankenstein’s monster, it will and has turned against us.

The best example of how our science turned against us would be the atomic bomb. The atomic bomb was the ironic last "tick-tock" of our modern dreams for a well ordered utopian society. By the beginning of the Cold War, this hope disintegrated into entropy and chaos. We lived in fear of our own science. We developed the ability to destroy ourselves on mass scale with atomic weapons. Our technology and knowledge made us less human, not more so. The clock ran down. And our trust in science as an unquestioned authority went with it.

With the postmodern condition, people are skeptical of absolute knowledge to truly solve the world’s ills. In this condition, the orderly God is not conceivable or receivable. There is simply too much out there. Descartes’ mechanical metaphor does not comfort us. As Isaiah 59:14 states, "Truth has stumbled in the streets." Now truths are seen as something that can only be socially constructed and locally relevant. Universals are observed with skepticism and indignation. There is only chaos, no order.

The Joker wrote:This quote is also interesting:

What happens when the clock runs down? (Chaos Theory)

Friedrich Nietzsche, one of the first philosophers to completely reject modernity, understood the end of this pursuit was nihilism. The quest for a perfect system of knowledge would collapse on itself. In his words: "There are no facts, only interpretations." Nothing we can place our faith in, except maybe the creation of our pursuit. But this creation is a beast. Like Frankenstein’s monster, it will and has turned against us.

The best example of how our science turned against us would be the atomic bomb. The atomic bomb was the ironic last "tick-tock" of our modern dreams for a well ordered utopian society. By the beginning of the Cold War, this hope disintegrated into entropy and chaos. We lived in fear of our own science. We developed the ability to destroy ourselves on mass scale with atomic weapons. Our technology and knowledge made us less human, not more so. The clock ran down. And our trust in science as an unquestioned authority went with it.

With the postmodern condition, people are skeptical of absolute knowledge to truly solve the world’s ills. In this condition, the orderly God is not conceivable or receivable. There is simply too much out there. Descartes’ mechanical metaphor does not comfort us. As Isaiah 59:14 states, "Truth has stumbled in the streets." Now truths are seen as something that can only be socially constructed and locally relevant. Universals are observed with skepticism and indignation. There is only chaos, no order.

whiteraven wrote:chaostheorie will never be discoverd

why? if you discover it it aint chaos anymore,, so that will make there is no theorie at all

like railway,, they seem to hit eachother in a distance but they never hit eachother,,
why are u peeps seaching for something what never will be found,,


i would rather search for things what can be discoverd,,

why is time running slower in space, after that,, u can ask yourself, what is time,, (they dont even know yet )

Innovacious wrote:

whiteraven wrote:chaostheorie will never be discoverd

why? if you discover it it aint chaos anymore,, so that will make there is no theorie at all

like railway,, they seem to hit eachother in a distance but they never hit eachother,,
why are u peeps seaching for something what never will be found,,


i would rather search for things what can be discoverd,,

why is time running slower in space, after that,, u can ask yourself, what is time,, (they dont even know yet )

youwhowhat?

whiteraven wrote:chaostheorie will never be discoverd

why? if you discover it it aint chaos anymore,, so that will make there is no theorie at all

like railway,, they seem to hit eachother in a distance but they never hit eachother,,
why are u peeps seaching for something what never will be found,,


i would rather search for things what can be discoverd,,

why is time running slower in space, after that,, u can ask yourself, what is time,, (they dont even know yet )

XemnasXD wrote:whats the point of this topic. Are we just citing quotes. Theres no real discussion going on which is a shame because it is a very interesting topic. I'll come back when this picks up.

2

Grandpa wrote:0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377...

The Golden Ratio can be seen (almost).

1+SqRt[5]

2

The Joker wrote:

Grandpa wrote:0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377...

The Golden Ratio can be seen (almost).

1+SqRt[5]

2

but the zero...

0+0 = 0

Hehe I am sorry if I look stupid, but I'm not fimilar with this.

The Joker wrote:

Grandpa wrote:0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377...

The Golden Ratio can be seen (almost).

1+SqRt[5]

2

but the zero...

0+0 = 0

Hehe I am sorry if I look stupid, but I'm not fimilar with this.

Grandpa wrote:

The Joker wrote:

Grandpa wrote:0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377...

The Golden Ratio can be seen (almost).

1+SqRt[5]

2

but the zero...

0+0 = 0

Hehe I am sorry if I look stupid, but I'm not fimilar with this.

lol - that's okay, here I am watching a movie about Jewish Mysticism and Numerology and doing website lookups for the math - trying to figure out the dilemma. Stupid? Absurd? The only 'stupid' or 'absurd' thought is my belief that i can somehow understand.

There is an overwhelming amount of data here. The concept that our universe can be represented mathematically is quite the broad assumption, yes?

Icealya wrote:why are those two clowns still here? (okay, it's actually one, and the other is some underwear-over-pants-freak but still)

The Joker wrote:

Icealya wrote:why are those two clowns still here? (okay, it's actually one, and the other is some underwear-over-pants-freak but still)

I have not been here for a long time.

Yet, already I know that none of your posts are contributing.

Burningwolf wrote:quit going into the batman, joker thing
let them discuss
i want to learn something new