In the Netherlands we have a tradition called Sinterklaas. You could almost say he's the Dutch equivalent of Santa Clause. He gives the kids presents if they were good and will give them salt and a spanking if they're bad. Sinterklaas isn't alone, he has tons of helpers. These helpers are called 'Zwarte Piet' (Black Pete) and are dressed up in a servant's costume, paint their faces black and wear black, curly wigs. Many people that didn't grow up with this tradition are now claiming it to be racist. It's a white man and he has black people as servants, this is what bothers people and makes them say it's racist. What do you guys think? The link I posted contains a video having exactly this debate. Is Zwarte Piet racist or not?
Spoiler!
For me, Zwarte Piet is not racist at all. I grew up with him and never once thought that it had any relation to racism or colonialism. I always presumed that Zwarte Piet was black because he climbed in and out through chimneys all day to deliver presents, and accumulated a lot of soot on his face/body. I am almost offended that people would claim it's racism. I get where they're coming from, but Sinterklaas is only perceived to be racist because he has black helpers. Sinterklaas doesn't teach any wrong values and never talks down to his helpers but is always kind. To see Sinterklaas as racist is, to me, just trying to find something racist to bitch about. I'll just say it: I think it's racist to think Sinterklaas is racist. This sounds weird, but what I mean is that in order to find Sinterklaas racist you have to believe that by definition it's racist to have a black helper when you're white. I think it's racist to believe that just because a white person leads black people he is abusing them. White people and our culture are made out to be the bad guys just because people have this racist idea that when a white man has black helpers it has to be racist and bad.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:20 pm
by omier
That's definitely not racist. But what bothers me is that he looks like the pope(minus the beard).
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:56 pm
by Love
Is not like the media constantly brings up nonsense.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:12 pm
by Squirt
Thought this was your santa?
Spoiler!
The dude who looks like a high level elf mage or something.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:15 pm
by heroo
what retard thinks Zwarte Piet is racist? It's a tradition for children and it has nothing to do with racism or history. If you can not make the difference between this cheerful tradition and history, you need to grow up. I feel like people are getting more stupid every day. They don't care for the real problems and keep coming up with this kind of nonsense.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:13 pm
by cbkilla
Dunno if its racist or not since im to lazy to look into the history of the holiday and see if it has anything to do with racism buuuut it does "seem" racist, which only makes it funnier L0L. Everyones to butthurt about stereotypes and "racist jokes" these days, everyone needs to smoke a bowl, laugh at each other, laugh at their selves and smoke more bowls.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:45 pm
by *BlackFox
Nah, It's not racist.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:52 pm
by MrTwilliger
I think it's racist that people get offended over the servants being black, but if the servants were white no one would say it's racist for oppressing white people. I demand equal opportunities for racism against white people!!!!!
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:58 pm
by CrimsonNuker
Nordinglish is always funny
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:08 am
by DarkBandit
Squirt wrote:Thought this was your santa?
Spoiler!
The dude who looks like a high level elf mage or something.
LOL
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 6:19 am
by Ger_slayer
cbkilla wrote:Dunno if its racist or not since im to lazy to look into the history of the holiday and see if it has anything to do with racism buuuut it does "seem" racist, which only makes it funnier L0L. Everyones to butthurt about stereotypes and "racist jokes" these days, everyone needs to smoke a bowl, laugh at each other, laugh at their selves and smoke more bowls.
That!
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:39 am
by Razorhead
important fact u didn't mention: The helpers aren't even really black! they are only black cuz of the coal residu that gets stuck on them from going down the chimney
I said it before & i'll say it again: The "racism card" is being played waaaaay too much
Just recently some black guy tried to ban a TinTin comic (Tintin in congo), because he found it racist... the people in congo were displayed as "slaves"... The book is from in the 30's; when Congo was still a "part" of belgium and people used them as slaves. So it only depicts the situation at the time
It's like saying the coloseum is racist because christians were fed to the lions there...
These "I find this racist" people are really starting to annoy me
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 3:01 pm
by omier
1:48
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:44 pm
by woutR
Razorhead wrote:important fact u didn't mention: The helpers aren't even really black! they are only black cuz of the coal residu that gets stuck on them from going down the chimney
woutR wrote:I always presumed that Zwarte Piet was black because he climbed in and out through chimneys all day to deliver presents, and accumulated a lot of soot on his face/body.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:03 pm
by Razorhead
woutR wrote:
Razorhead wrote:important fact u didn't mention: The helpers aren't even really black! they are only black cuz of the coal residu that gets stuck on them from going down the chimney
woutR wrote:I always presumed that Zwarte Piet was black because he climbed in and out through chimneys all day to deliver presents, and accumulated a lot of soot on his face/body.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:36 pm
by Swindler
No it's not racist, just the same way gingerbreads aren't racism. Serval schools banned them in Sweden just because they were black, more correctly brown and it could be insulting to foreigners. This is getting out of hand really.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:41 pm
by woutR
Swindler wrote:No it's not racist, just the same way gingerbreads aren't racism. Serval schools banned them in Sweden just because they were black, more correctly brown and it could be insulting to foreigners. This is getting out of hand really.
lold
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 2:45 am
by TheDrop
Well from the little amount of history you put and as a outsider it does seem to have racial undertones based on imperialism/colonialism.. Then again even the usual Santa Claus & elves, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, lord of the rings, etc seem to have racist undertones. This one just seems to be more obvious.
I remember cases of black soccer players in Russia, Spain, Italy etc being called monkey and having thrown bananas at them during matches..so thats obviously a bigger problem than some christmas gig
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:43 pm
by CrimsonNuker
Germany's Belschnickel also has a Zwarte Piet
This episode was epic btw. Sinterklass is still the best looking Santa Claus though.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:54 pm
by .curve
cbkilla wrote:Dunno if its racist or not since im to lazy to look into the history of the holiday and see if it has anything to do with racism buuuut it does "seem" racist, which only makes it funnier L0L. Everyones to butthurt about stereotypes and "racist jokes" these days, everyone needs to smoke a bowl, laugh at each other, laugh at their selves and smoke more bowls.
This. Completely this.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:22 pm
by *BlackFox
Seriously! Why do some people always "blame" racism on everything? It's getting ridiculous!
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:38 pm
by Bartic
*BlackFox wrote:Seriously! Why do some people always "blame" racism on everything? It's getting ridiculous!
Only black guys do it.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:52 pm
by omier
^Not only guys.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:27 pm
by Swindler
Actually, it's more white people who believes it's racism. Most black most likely dont give a fuck.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:40 pm
by .curve
Swindler wrote:Actually, it's more white people who believes it's racism. Most black most likely dont give a fuck.
I disagree. The NAACP bitching about everything is proof enough.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:50 pm
by Swindler
In the US maybe, cant speak for you guys over there. In Sweden most dont seem to give a shit. Btw. who's the chick in your avatar?
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:00 am
by .curve
Swindler wrote:In the US maybe, cant speak for you guys over there. In Sweden most dont seem to give a shit. Btw. who's the chick in your avatar?
Taylor Swift, but you can't have her, she's my angel.
Re: Would you consider 'Zwarte Piet' to be racist?
