History of the USA

[Thomas42]

/let the flames continue

[heroo]

@ all the people posting pictures of ''flame beginz'' and I don't know what kind of sh!t, just stop. It doesn't make you smarter. Don't act like you're grown up and can foresee how this thread will end up. Either contribute to the discussion or don't post at all.

OT: I Xemnas.

[Tasdik]

I love all of the anti fox news people around here. It's cute = p

@ Mansex, what would you suggest then to turn this country around for the better?

[rumpleKillskin]

Since this thread will continue on and on...


remember who has Chuck Norris.

[Ashikiheyun]

I love all of the anti fox news people around here. It's cute = p

@ Mansex, what would you suggest then to turn this country around for the better?

Are you pro fox news? The ridiculous things they manufacture and report on amazes me.

[Tasdik]

Funny thing, just now I turned on the TV and watched Fox News and CNN. Foxnews was reporting about the Health Care bill while CNN was talking about Chocolate Bacon.

I don't really have any feelings towards Fox news. Neither negative or positive. Their just another news company. I just don't hate them like y'all do.

[XemnasXD]

I never said FOX didn't address issues and i never said CNN was worth watching...

I said CNN was for ppl who don't know news and FOX is for ppl who like fake news...I have no doubt FOX was talking up a load of BS about healthcare and its going to kill old people and raise MJ from the dead while CNN was talking about nothing...

[Tasdik]

I have no doubt FOX was talking up a load of BS about healthcare and its going to kill old people and raise MJ from the dead while

Oh the irony.

[Reise]

Pearl Harbor has been the only attack by a foreign nation on our soil in over 160 years...9/11 was the first attack by a foreign organized terrorist organization on our soil in over 200 years

whose shoving their ideals down our throats exactly...

If you understood what I had said, I'd say we are doing our job just fine then.

[Shadow]

Heyheyhey, just some points. The common picture of vikings is rather ahistorical. Vikings did not just rape, burn and plunder every village. Sure they did that every now and then too, but they were also merchants and explorers.
But it's not like the northern europe was all calm and nice before and after the viking age... Raids and skirmishes between settlements, tribes and such. It's still bloody history, even though not so well known. Bloody like the history of humankind in general. "Since the dawn of humankind, when our ancestors first discovered the killing power of rock and bone..." Err, back on topic then...

Have you ever listened to Volbeat? hey, emm... What were we talking about again? Ah yes, sins of the US, greatness of the US, how the US invented democrazy, and won all wars and still managed to maintain peace? Sorry the sarcasm, I really had to...
I don't hate any country, nor think that my country is better than others just because I was born here. Blind patriotism is plain stupid. Combine that with ignorance and you got the cocktail of centuries.

Did I read somewhere here that everyone wants to live in the states, and that the US closer to perfection than any other country? Did someone say that US won the 2nd WW? If that's not blind (and ignorant) patriotism... This reminds me of the old thread, you know the one with the super ignorant russian troll; The Pearl Harbor thread. And no, the sun does not orbit the United States.


Gotta agree with Sharp though, these threads are amusing.. in a sense...

[XemnasXD]

Pearl Harbor has been the only attack by a foreign nation on our soil in over 160 years...9/11 was the first attack by a foreign organized terrorist organization on our soil in over 200 years

whose shoving their ideals down our throats exactly...

If you understood what I had said, I'd say we are doing our job just fine then.

And if you understood what i just said you'd see that nobody has been trying to shove anything down our throat for over 160 years...jumping the gun abit yeah. Bit of a paradox to say we've got to get them before they get us only they only wanted to get us after we tried to get them.

The real word for it is asinine but to you it seems to be diplomacy.

[Reise]

Nobody has been shoving anything down our throat because we're busy doing it to them.

Or we could just stop being active in the world community and just let everyone else impose themselves on us. In fact, Obama should show us how "well" this works soon enough, if he hasn't already.

Bit of a paradox to say we've got to get them before they get us only they only wanted to get us after we tried to get them.

I think it's funny you believe that.

As if the US didn't have to fight to get where it is.

[XemnasXD]

Who is trying to impose themselves on us...name the top 3 people who are trying to impose themselves on the US today i bet that we helped make them what they are today...

even that aside when you take away the terrorist the only people who have something against us are the people who we royal screwed over for decades. I didn't see them carpet bombing us or assassinating our leaders. No one has been trying to the impose on since WWII. No nation has taken active military steps to conquer the US or to overthrow the US gov't.

You're punching shadows with missiles and then wondering where all these angry ppl are coming from...

[Reise]

Who is trying to impose themselves on us...name the top 3 people who are trying to impose themselves on the US today i bet that we helped make them what they are today...

Iran, North Korea, China. I'm sure there are/would be far more if we started bending over for some of them.

even that aside when you take away the terrorist the only people who have something against us are the people who we royal screwed over for decades. I didn't see them carpet bombing us or assassinating our leaders. No one has been trying to the impose on since WWII. No nation has taken active military steps to conquer the US or to overthrow the US gov't.

Well, that could be thanks to some of those shady acts you hate about the US so much. You can still sit down at a computer and rant about these things thanks to our country shitting on others. Not everything is for some evil plot to control the world. Hard to believe, I know.

You're punching shadows with missiles and then wondering where all these angry ppl are coming from...

I'm not punching anything because I don't have to. The world is a lot more complicated than either of us know, and to sit here bickering about "oooh the US did this and that, they are so bad" is just so amazingly futile and pointless it surprises me that you feel so strongly about it.

This topic started with a shit film by a shit director, and he did the same thing you're doing now. Complaining about things we have no control over, and failing to see the bigger picture in all of it. When you are a giant, you are going to step on people. It's inevitable, it sucks, and to bitch about it is like bitching at the sky for being blue.

[XemnasXD]

We are responsible for Iran coming to Power. North Koreas power is a result of the Proxy war between the US and the USSR. Lastly, we are already Chinas bitch, they own us, they have nothing to gain by overthrowing us, they need us to work hard so we can pay them back all the money we owe. Even taking all that into account China has never tried to change the American way of life. They're not our enemy, they're our bank.


You may think that we don't deserve all the shit we're running into now and that everyone had it coming but us and that if we didn't take them down a peg they would've taken us down a peg but that bully mentality hasn't gotten us anywhere in 50 years. We're running out of allies, we only have about 240 ships in our navy spread across the entire world. We are pouring so much money into our military efforts we now have a trillion dollar debt. We outsourced so much of our labor we're falling in industry. We can't even give our citizens healthcare or a proper education. Thats the truth of the matter.

Going by your train of thought why even post in this in the first place to bitch about moore. The movie was made, it made a ton of money, alot of people liked it, completely out of your control so why some here to cry about him and his movie being unfair. Im not complaining im discussing and arguing if you don't like those things then i think you're in the wrong place. If you think its simply complaining then you could've done us all a favor and not posted anything in this thread at all.

[Casawi]

Jstar i almost died of laughning when i did read your post,Usa saved the world? hmm kay usa that didnt even kill 0.1% of the german military lmao!
While soviet union have killed 85% of the german army and the german army got 91% of material losses in russia,russia saved world from nazism russia did put the russian flag on berlin wich means they defeated germany,And no the snow didnt helped russians,if then,russians to did froze they are humans to like germans,in stalingrad there were lot of houses and germans hided in them and in kursk there was no snow,so The snow theory that got created by american propaganda fails.they just want to remove the credit from the soviets,america helped only in trucks and food spam,their weapons were not used because they did suck.
And the german army vs the us army alone 1vs1 no allies no help from anyone germany would kicked us ass from alaska to texas.
if you need 10 sherman tanks to destroy a tiger tank and 15sherman tanks to destroy a tiger tank.
I Wonder how they will make it.

[Goobronicus]

Jstar i almost died of laughning when i did read your post,Usa saved the world? hmm kay usa that didnt even kill 0.1% of the german military lmao!
While soviet union have killed 85% of the german army and the german army got 91% of material losses in russia,russia saved world from nazism russia did put the russian flag on berlin wich means they defeated germany,And no the snow didnt helped russians,if then,russians to did froze they are humans to like germans,in stalingrad there were lot of houses and germans hided in them and in kursk there was no snow,so The snow theory that got created by american propaganda fails.they just want to remove the credit from the soviets,america helped only in trucks and food spam,their weapons were not used because they did suck.
And the german army vs the us army alone 1vs1 no allies no help from anyone germany would kicked us ass from alaska to texas.
if you need 10 sherman tanks to destroy a tiger tank and 15sherman tanks to destroy a tiger tank.
I Wonder how they will make it.

Punctuation (other than commas...), spacing, capitalization, non stream-of-consciousness format.... USE THEM.


Guhhhhhhhhhhh (brain asplode)

Though I am impressed by your 0.1% vs .1 % usage. Very good.

[Reise]

We are responsible for Iran coming to Power. North Koreas power is a result of the Proxy war between the US and the USSR. Lastly, we are already Chinas bitch, they own us, they have nothing to gain by overthrowing us, they need us to work hard so we can pay them back all the money we owe. Even taking all that into account China has never tried to change the American way of life. They're not our enemy, they're our bank.

So they don't count because we're responsible for their current situation? I don't see how that matters. A threat's a threat.

Going by your train of thought why even post in this in the first place to bitch about moore. The movie was mad, it made a ton of money, alot of people liked it, completely out of your control so why some here to cry about him and his movie being unfair.

Well, this is the off topic forum and me being me, I decided to throw my two cents in. It felt appropriate since a lot of the people posting believed every word in that video as if it were stone-carved truth. Moore is a dick, simple as that.

[XemnasXD]

Its threat we made. We are supposed to learn from history not repeat the same mistakes. We got into the mess "policing" the world and you think that more "policing" is going to get us out of it...smooth....you've really been paying attention.

Btw sounds like your just complaining about moore to me and every word in the video is true anyway so what the hell are you so pissed at...

[Reise]

Right Xem, I'm sure the people in charge consistently **** things up on purpose, ignoring history and all that jazz. If they're truly that stupid, we don't have anyone to blame but ourselves for letting them do it. Personally I don't believe that's the way things work.

every word in the video is true anyway

It's a joke. And that's why I can't debate with you on any even level.

[XemnasXD]

I asked you to name the inaccuracies and you didn't. I don't see any inaccuracies. Im not even debating it. Yeah its a joke but like i said nothing they say is wrong. No one in this thread has proven anything to the contrary including you, you just cry about it. Moore sucks, he's fat but you haven't proven anything other than the clear fact that you don't like him.

And you're right we don't have anyone to blame but ourselves for letting them do it. That is why this is important to me because in a democratically elected gov't we are in control. When Ron Paul was running for election you were all for ending the imperialist agenda like him but now you're just going *shrug* its out of our hands, its really our leaders fault and theres nothing we can do about it. Thats really supposed to be the mindset of the citizen of a democracy. Look at the list. You can choose not to believe it but its there and proves that time and time again our leaders ignore history. Every credible General said Iraq was a bad idea, we shouldn't be worrying about saddam right now, he doesn't have nuclear weapons and we went in anyway. The only reason why Bush was able to get away with so much is because the people YOU elected to represent you did nothing. Its as much YOUR and my fault as it is theres. Don't shirk the responsibility but support the actions, what kind of move is that.

[Reise]

Xem if you think I'm crying about any of this I've just wasted my time here. Acknowledging the actions of our leaders and supporting them are two different things. I don't support those particular actions but at some level I understand that they had to have been necessary or else they wouldn't have happened at all.

Look at the list. You can choose not to believe it but its there and proves that time and time again our leaders ignore history. Every credible General said Iraq was a bad idea, we shouldn't be worrying abotu saddam right now, he doesn't have nuclear weapons and we went in anyway.

Shit happens. Last I checked we're still paying the price for it, so it's not as if we're just running amok spreading glorious democracy everywhere we please.

The only reason why Bush was able to get away with so much is because the people YOU elected to represent you did nothing. Its as much YOUR and my fault as it is theres.

And I agree totally.

[XemnasXD]

Shit happens yeah but like i said someone didn't understep the side walk right into The Vietnam War then miss the bus and fund Castro then trip and kill the elected leader of the congo then stumble into arming the warlords that kept the region in turmoil for decades....

This isn't shit happening. Thats like saying in a top tier game of chess shit just happens and all the moves are just random mistakes. I can't see how you don't see that these are very deliberate actions taken by our gov't time and time again and though they said they were for our best interest they might have been lying. We didn't have any business in half the countries we're in now until we got there and if you just think its shit happening then shit'll happen and we'll end up in Iran then more Shit'll happen and we'll end up in North Korea.

Theres got to be a point where you stop saying shit happens and then just "understand" that whatever road we take it was for our best interest in the long term...

[Reise]

Theres got to be a point where you stop saying shit happens and then just "understand" that whatever road we take it was for our best interest in the long term...

There is. It's usually that point in time where common sense tells me "Hey, they had nothing to gain from this, so maybe it was just a serious **** up." And then I move on with my life.

Certain things the government has done could be filed under "shit happens" certain things could also be filed under "oops my bad" and "if we do this it could benefit us, even though it's wrong." To be honest I doubt anyone could do better than that.

I'm not going to pretend I understand everything and assert that there was always a sinister plan and purpose behind all the shit surrounding the US. I'm also not content with letting others believe they DO understand everything, and then tell me I'm wrong for thinking some cracked eggs are necessary, whether they were broken on purpose or not.

[Tasdik]

The only reason why Bush was able to get away with so much is because the people YOU elected to represent you did nothing. Its as much YOUR and my fault as it is theres. Don't shirk the responsibility but support the actions, what kind of move is that.

I can't believe you bastards allowed this to happen. *says this since he hasn't been able to vote yet <3*

[cpinney]

we need more threads like this.

[XemnasXD]

The reasons don't matter at this point. We're not debating the reasons. We're debating the effects of their actions. If their reason was to help fight USSR forces that may be all well in good but the effect is that it created a terrorist organization that smashed two planes into the twin towers killing 2700 people.

Saying shit happens or we had good reason isn't good enough. Instead of paying with American lives then we're paying for it now and gaining more and more enemies to boot.

The reason was helping to top USSR influence in the middle east. The effect was allowing a dictator to rise to power who killed thousands of civilians who we later removed killing more civilians and this time US troops.

You think im looking at the causes and seeing an evil plot. Im looking at the effects and the evil it created. If it was just one incident that turned out badly then maybe it would be excusable but all those leaders we got rid of be it for good/bad/neutral reason weave a twisted web of effects that have shattered millions of lives while we sit back safe and sound unaffected by any of it.

The reasons for our past actions don't excuse their effects. Millions of lives lost, multiple dictators created, and now we have one of the terrorist organizations we helped about to gain control of a country with nuclear weapons....

Common sense should've kicked in by now. The shoot before they get guns mentality hasn't helped us. The "Its us or them" mentality hasn't held up. All the things we've done in the name of these types of operations have hurt us. Where is the point that you realize that and start looking for change instead of just saying Shit Happens then going along with the Imperial agenda.

[Reise]

It's not like anyone knew the mujahideen would go and start trying to take over Afghanistan. Nobody knew the USSR would crumble shortly after the whole incident. I don't have a magical future-telling crystal ball, and I doubt the US government does either.

The reasons for our past actions don't excuse their effects.

At least most of those people originally acted with good intentions. We wanted to see Afghanistan liberated and united, not destroyed by in-fighting and extremism. For that, we're still there today working on what's left.

I'd rather they acted with good intent than not act at all. If they hadn't, Afghanistan would be just another part of the Soviet Union, with front door access to the middle east's resources, and we would probably still be stuck in a cold war.

[XemnasXD]

They acted with good intentions by basically starting a civil war. I'd prefer they had don't nothing because eventually the USSR would've collapsed due to the fighting that was already running rampant and when it did Afghanistan would be fine and the Taliban wouldn't have had the means to rise to power.

We can't keep doing stuff like that. The road to hell is paved with good intentions and we've done enough to build a highway. My father always told me sorry doesn't heal wounds, the same goes for good intentions. You don't need a crystal ball to know what will happen if you arm a terrorist organization and even if you didn't know why would you do it over and over and over again not learning from your first mistake. Come on, fool us once shame on you, fool us multiple times for the next 50 years shame on us.

You can say we didn't know what would happen the first time or the second time but the third fourth fifth and so on...whats the excuse then....

There's got to be a point where learn from our mistakes...its been 60 years and you're still talking like we should be doing the same stuff we were doing before and damn the consequence! We've got good intentions!

[Blurred]

wow i read the entire topic...


shutdown -i