Mosque near Ground Zero

[Ownage]

Pretty sure we didn't go to war with Islam, but the asswipes that instigated the attack.

And Saddam on the side.

The war didn't start in 2001.

It did actually, the War on Terrorism actually passed soon after 9/11 IIRC, but the war on iraq was 2003, I think, might have been 02.

Edit:
By war on terrorism, it makes Afghan.

[Bananaman]

i say we build a big fat christain church and community center near the locations we bombed in Iraq and Afghanistan in the name of understanding and tolerance.

Yeah It just seems like whoever wants the mosque there wants to just piss people off, and try to *force* people to be more *Tolerant* or whatever. Yeah its still 2 blocks away but still, If you were one of the family members of those who didn't survive 9/11 Id think you would have a different opinion. Yeah it may be *the RIGHT thing to do* but if you look it from their view point it just seems like muslims are sticking their ass in their faces and taunting them...it may not be true but still, that's what it seems like.

It just seems to be disrespectful

They should just build it a mile away

and 2 blocks away in NEW YORK CITY is still pretty damn close

[XemnasXD]

i say we build a big fat christain church and community center near the locations we bombed in Iraq and Afghanistan in the name of understanding and tolerance.

Yeah It just seems like whoever wants the mosque there wants to just piss people off, and try to *force* people to be more *Tolerant* or whatever. Yeah its still 2 blocks away but still, If you were one of the family members of those who didn't survive 9/11 Id think you would have a different opinion. Yeah it may be *the RIGHT thing to do* but if you look it from their view point it just seems like muslims are sticking their ass in their faces and taunting them...it may not be true but still, that's what it seems like.

It just seems to be disrespectful

They should just build it a mile away

and 2 blocks away in NEW YORK CITY is still pretty damn close

If that's the way the families of 9/11 victims feel then they're retarded and should be ignored. After 9/11 everyone was so gung-ho about flying that flag and waving it around that they forgot what that flag is supposed to stand for. So we end up with things like the Iraq war which had nothing to do with anything. And we end up with things like The Patriot Act, which is fascism not patriotism. Now people are once again so wrapped up in what they think is american that they're forgetting the very laws and ideas the country is supposed to stand for.

[Toshiharu]

Yeah It just seems like whoever wants the mosque there wants to just piss people off, and try to *force* people to be more *Tolerant* or whatever. Yeah its still 2 blocks away but still, If you were one of the family members of those who didn't survive 9/11 Id think you would have a different opinion. Yeah it may be *the RIGHT thing to do* but if you look it from their view point it just seems like muslims are sticking their ass in their faces and taunting them...it may not be true but still, that's what it seems like.

It just seems to be disrespectful

They should just build it a mile away

and 2 blocks away in NEW YORK CITY is still pretty damn close

Because a Mosque represents a Muslim terrorist group?
Because there surely wasn't one Muslim in the towers?

It has nothing to do with tolerance. People think way too much and connect dots that don't even go together.

[Jstar1]

nothing wrong with building a mosque, but whose the sonofabitch that wants to build near ground zero? Its like they did it on purpose to get people angry. Theres enough religious tension because of muslim terrorists, why build more tension?

[Skyve]

Pretty sure we didn't go to war with Islam, but the asswipes that instigated the attack.

And Saddam on the side.

The war didn't start in 2001.

Ohh you fail soooooooooooooooooo hard

(ex soldier)

By "war" I'm talking about the problems between Iraq & the States. Even by you're understanding of war(9/11 event), the war on Iraq started March 20,2003. Next time you reply as such at least provide a reason because right now you just look like a ignorant person.

[MrJoey]

Edit: Initial reaction was without enough information, need more before I give an opinion.

[McLovin1t]

I kind of have to disagree with building. I know that not all muslims are like this etc. but doing this is like building the NRA headquarters in Columbine, I mean, it's disrespectful, even though I understand what they are trying to do.

[XemnasXD]

I kind of have to disagree with building. I know that not all muslims are like this etc. but doing this is like building the NRA headquarters in Columbine, I mean, it's disrespectful, even though I understand what they are trying to do.

Guess who held a convention in Denver that year. The NRA. Guess who protested. Alot of people. Guess why they still went forward with it. Because this is America...

It has nothing to do with tolerance, and everything to do with insulting the people who lost their lives on 9/11. I don't care if it isn't extremist Muslims building it there, fact is, Muslims were responsible, and I bet Osama bin Laden will be having a big party if a Mosque is built right next to ground zero.

You realize that Muslim extremist kill muslims too right? Like They kidnap kids from their rooms and starve, torture, and brainwash them until they'll carry out suicide missions for them?

Osama probably hates this center and what it stands for just as much as the people trying to tear it down. It's a bridge of peace. Why would something like that get him excited. Osama is about as Muslim as the Westboro Baptist Church is Christian. Things like this don't make people like him happy.

[McLovin1t]

Yeah I know the NRA did that in Columbine, and that's a terrible thing lol. I don't really care if Osama cares or not, it's just the principle. It's like building some Japanese cultural icon, I don't want to sound silly, because I don't know any real icons , in like Nanjing, or Pearl Harbor.

[XemnasXD]

That depends on what the monument it to. They're not building a "**** you america" museum. They're building a cultural center and a place of worship. They've been using it as mosque for months. They could've been using it as a mosque for years and it wouldn't have sparked this kind of debate. Now they're scaling it up a bit and adding a center so people can come and learn about muslim culture and it's a problem.

Muslims didn't knock down those towers. Muslim Extemist did. If you can't differentiate the two then people like you are the reason why we ended up in Iraq fighting Saddam when we should've been in Afghanistan fighting the Taliban and Al-Queda. In my eyes that kind of ignorance is far more dangerous to my way of life than a cultural center...

[McLovin1t]

Of course I understand the difference, and I see what you are arguing. Again, I am not being ignorant whatsoever, and of course they aren't building what you said. However, a muslim place of worship (pretty much the general representation for Islan) is being built right where Muslims (I am NOT GENERALIZING, just stating facts) bombed those buildings. Whether or not it's a cultural place or whatever, it's still disrespectful. I mean again look to my example with the NRA, and with Japan. You wouldn't want Japan to build a cultural center right at Pearl Harbor, right next to the harbor, would you? I mean not all of the Japanese were a part of it...
You see what I'm getting at?

[.Banshee]

Of course I understand the difference, and I see what you are arguing. Again, I am not being ignorant whatsoever, and of course they aren't building what you said. However, a muslim place of worship (pretty much the general representation for Islan) is being built right where Muslims (I am NOT GENERALIZING, just stating facts) bombed those buildings. Whether or not it's a cultural place or whatever, it's still disrespectful. I mean again look to my example with the NRA, and with Japan. You wouldn't want Japan to build a cultural center right at Pearl Harbor, right next to the harbor, would you? I mean not all of the Japanese were a part of it...
You see what I'm getting at?

Disrespectful how? Just because a few Muslim extremist killed a lot of people in the name of Islam, which is open to individual interpretation, that makes everything associated with the religion wrong and disrespectful? Dude you need to wise up. Islam is not the culprit here and never will be, religion is an abstract notion that has no free will. It can't force anyone to do anything. The culprits are the extremists who did the killing because they were foolish enough to believe that they were so important that the world must bow down to them and their ideas. PERIOD. And your Japanese example is retarded. Japanese culture doesn't revolve around the Pearl Harbor incident and if there was a traditional Japanese trinket shop at Pearl harbor, I wouldn't give a damn. I'd give a damn if someone shouted "Long live Hirohito" at services honoring Pearl Harbor victims though.

[McLovin1t]

You clearly don't understand my argument. I understand the culprits, I understand who did what etc, but also, the Islam religion is widely represented in the case of 9/11. Of course japanese culture isn't all revolving around Pearl Harbor, but you wouldn't build a japanese cultural center right next to the memorial area. If you would, then I guess you really have no sympathy?

[XemnasXD]

Of course I understand the difference, and I see what you are arguing. Again, I am not being ignorant whatsoever, and of course they aren't building what you said. However, a muslim place of worship (pretty much the general representation for Islan) is being built right where Muslims (I am NOT GENERALIZING, just stating facts) bombed those buildings. Whether or not it's a cultural place or whatever, it's still disrespectful. I mean again look to my example with the NRA, and with Japan. You wouldn't want Japan to build a cultural center right at Pearl Harbor, right next to the harbor, would you? I mean not all of the Japanese were a part of it...
You see what I'm getting at?

You are both generalizing and stating a fact.

But let's follow your logic here. The Westboro Baptist Church pickets military funerals and tells the families of fallen soldiers that their family member is going to hell, a f*gs, and Jesus enjoyed killing them. They are a Christian group. So because they're disrespectful to the military and our soldiers overseas there should be no churches in or around military bases. I mean Christians are responsible for protest like that so anything Christian is disrespectful the families of those fallen soldiers.

[.Banshee]

No I clearly understand your argument. But there is no reason why a whole group of people should have to suffer for the actions of a few, that even within that group are considered outsiders. Respect my ass, a mosque has nothing to do with the preemptive strike on the world trade centers. That was purely human folly and nothing else. Just like Japanese culture, Islam didn't attack anything. People did. And no sympathy? I just showed you an example of sympathy.

[Toshiharu]

You clearly don't understand my argument. I understand the culprits, I understand who did what etc, but also, the Islam religion is widely represented in the case of 9/11. Of course japanese culture isn't all revolving around Pearl Harbor, but you wouldn't build a japanese cultural center right next to the memorial area. If you would, then I guess you really have no sympathy?

I suppose because of 2 nukes Americans shouldn't go to Japan? I'm sorry, but your argument doesn't make sense.

A group of religious terrorists = every one of the religion?

Really? Damn people need to wise up a bit. I remember when 9-11 happened and you'd see all these crazy white people(White people? Yeah. Not a group of Mexicans, Blacks, Polish, and/or what ever else. Chicago is very mixed of everyone here so uhh..) protesting(or what ever you may call it) that our religion is wrong, we caused thousands to die from the towers, and should go back to our own country. And you say respect? HERP DERP Christianity slaughtered people in history for the silliest shit as much as the next. I'm not sure exactly what I'm trying to say here other than the terrorist group = / = the entire religion?

[Barotix]

Could care less, people losing sleep over this are idiots.

[McLovin1t]

Of course I understand the difference, and I see what you are arguing. Again, I am not being ignorant whatsoever, and of course they aren't building what you said. However, a muslim place of worship (pretty much the general representation for Islan) is being built right where Muslims (I am NOT GENERALIZING, just stating facts) bombed those buildings. Whether or not it's a cultural place or whatever, it's still disrespectful. I mean again look to my example with the NRA, and with Japan. You wouldn't want Japan to build a cultural center right at Pearl Harbor, right next to the harbor, would you? I mean not all of the Japanese were a part of it...
You see what I'm getting at?

You are both generalizing and stating a fact.

But let's follow your logic here. The Westboro Baptist Church pickets military funerals and tells the families of fallen soldiers that their family member is going to hell, a f*gs, and Jesus enjoyed killing them. They are a Christian group. So because they're disrespectful to the military and our soldiers overseas there should be no churches in or around military bases. I mean Christians are responsible for protest like that so anything Christian is disrespectful the families of those fallen soldiers.

So I wouldn't build a Baptist church near a military cemetery. Simple as that lol. And to the thing with the nukes. I wouldn't build an American Cultural center, or museum, or whatever, near the MEMORIAL site of the atom bomb. Not Japan lol. I mean just at the memorial areas, not in the whole country.
Like Columbine, ground zero, pearl harbor memorial area, atom bomb memorial area, etc. Not the country. And I'm not losing sleep lol, I'm just saying my opinion.

[XemnasXD]

Of course I understand the difference, and I see what you are arguing. Again, I am not being ignorant whatsoever, and of course they aren't building what you said. However, a muslim place of worship (pretty much the general representation for Islan) is being built right where Muslims (I am NOT GENERALIZING, just stating facts) bombed those buildings. Whether or not it's a cultural place or whatever, it's still disrespectful. I mean again look to my example with the NRA, and with Japan. You wouldn't want Japan to build a cultural center right at Pearl Harbor, right next to the harbor, would you? I mean not all of the Japanese were a part of it...
You see what I'm getting at?

You are both generalizing and stating a fact.

But let's follow your logic here. The Westboro Baptist Church pickets military funerals and tells the families of fallen soldiers that their family member is going to hell, a f*gs, and Jesus enjoyed killing them. They are a Christian group. So because they're disrespectful to the military and our soldiers overseas there should be no churches in or around military bases. I mean Christians are responsible for protest like that so anything Christian is disrespectful the families of those fallen soldiers.

So I wouldn't build a Baptist church near a military cemetery. Simple as that lol. And to the thing with the nukes. I wouldn't build an American Cultural center, or museum, or whatever, near the MEMORIAL site of the atom bomb. Not Japan lol. I mean just at the memorial areas, not in the whole country.
Like Columbine, ground zero, pearl harbor memorial area, atom bomb memorial area, etc. Not the country. And I'm not losing sleep lol, I'm just saying my opinion.

Not just a baptist Church. Any Christian church. And you can't say i wouldn't build because there are already tons of Churches near military cemeteries. So if you're agreeing that it's disrespectful i'd expect you to campaign for the removal of all those churches.

[Krevidy]

Question, why isn't it allowed to build a church in most muslim countries?

[Ownage]

Question, why isn't it allowed to build a church in most muslim countries?

Well for one I am sure not too many Christians live in the middle east.

Edit: Apparently noone in Afghan can legally convert to Christianity and there is only 1 church in Afghan and local national's can't go there.

[XemnasXD]

Question, why isn't it allowed to build a church in most muslim countries?

most muslim countries are a theocracy or their laws are heavily based on a theocratic style. So if it's not Islam you're probably not going to be doing it.

[McLovin1t]

Well xemnas, im not going to do anything about it. All I said is that it was disrespectful lol. So building a japanese cultural center at the memorial site for pearl harbor wouldn't be disrespectful? I truly think you must lack compassion lol. I know that not all japanese did this or whatever, I am just saying, it brings up reminders, etc.
Same with the mosque at ground zero imo. I mean, the only thing good I think about this, is that it says we forgive them, but we already have mosques in our country, so I think that building it on ground zero just isn't right.

[Fiction]

So I wouldn't build a Baptist church near a military cemetery. Simple as that lol. And to the thing with the nukes. I wouldn't build an American Cultural center, or museum, or whatever, near the MEMORIAL site of the atom bomb. Not Japan lol. I mean just at the memorial areas, not in the whole country.
Like Columbine, ground zero, pearl harbor memorial area, atom bomb memorial area, etc. Not the country. And I'm not losing sleep lol, I'm just saying my opinion.

See this is all in your opinion. America is supposed to be a nation of laws not men. If the law says they're allowed to build it, then they should be allowed to. They had to have already went through hell, I can't even build myself a privacy fence without getting my neighbors to agree and permits I cannot understand why you are being so nostalgic about all these locations on the face of our earth, when you were just talking about slowing the growth of society.

The NRA thing I'm still not sure on either. What did the NRA have to do with what happened at that school? They simply believe every American citizen(not felon) has the right to own a gun. Which is what the 2nd amendment says. The NRA never came to Columbine after the shooting went on, they were in Denver for a meeting that was planned to be there a year+ in advance. Too much Micheal more-too much "BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE" if you think the NRA had anything to do with what happened.

--Edit-- The Mosque location isn't even on ground zero.

[ApocalypticDeath]

Pakistan has a lot of churches, so does Malaysia and many other Islam dominant countries. It's only Saudi Arabia and that's mainly because its considered holy land and the majority there are Muslims (don't think you would want to live there otherwise). Why doesn't Vatican city have mosques? Because its christian holy land.

p.s XemnasXD your answers are pretty good

[McLovin1t]

So I wouldn't build a Baptist church near a military cemetery. Simple as that lol. And to the thing with the nukes. I wouldn't build an American Cultural center, or museum, or whatever, near the MEMORIAL site of the atom bomb. Not Japan lol. I mean just at the memorial areas, not in the whole country.
Like Columbine, ground zero, pearl harbor memorial area, atom bomb memorial area, etc. Not the country. And I'm not losing sleep lol, I'm just saying my opinion.

See this is all in your opinion. America is supposed to be a nation of laws not men. If the law says they're allowed to build it, then they should be allowed to. They had to have already went through hell, I can't even build myself a privacy fence without getting my neighbors to agree and permits I cannot understand why you are being so nostalgic about all these locations on the face of our earth, when you were just talking about slowing the growth of society.

The NRA thing I'm still not sure on either. What did the NRA have to do with what happened at that school? They simply believe every American citizen(not felon) has the right to own a gun. Which is what the 2nd amendment says. The NRA never came to Columbine after the shooting went on, they were in Denver for a meeting that was planned to be there a year+ in advance. Too much Micheal more-too much "BOWLING FOR COLUMBINE" if you think the NRA had anything to do with what happened.

--Edit-- The Mosque location isn't even on ground zero.

Well, to the last part with the Bowling For Columbine. Of course the NRA was involved, how else could they get guns lol?
NRA -> guns? That's not why they shot the school up, but it helped? And I am not saying you can't build it, it's just disrespectful lol. And laws are made to protect men. For example, slander etc, doesn't harm people in some cases, but it's out of respect etc, which is where rules come from, respect. We can just agree to disagree? And to me, growth of society is very technologically based, considering morality changes regardless of what happens, lol.

[CeLL]

Question, why isn't it allowed to build a church in most muslim countries?

dont assume all countries have the same freedoms your country may allow.

[Fiction]

People that intend to do bad things are going to get guns, it doesn't have anything to do with the NRA. Take the gangs, colts, and cartels for example. Besides, most of my family including myself own at least one gun, and none of us have ever went out and shot up a school. So if you're going to blame someone, blame the kids or the parents.

[XemnasXD]

Well xemnas, im not going to do anything about it. All I said is that it was disrespectful lol. So building a japanese cultural center at the memorial site for pearl harbor wouldn't be disrespectful? I truly think you must lack compassion lol. I know that not all japanese did this or whatever, I am just saying, it brings up reminders, etc.
Same with the mosque at ground zero imo. I mean, the only thing good I think about this, is that it says we forgive them, but we already have mosques in our country, so I think that building it on ground zero just isn't right.

They're not building on ground zero. They're building 2 blocks away from it. Whats a good enough distance away from Ground Zero for a Mosque not to be considered disrespectful? Who gets to decide decides something like that?

You're generalizing in the worst way. The Muslim extremist who were responsible for 9/11 are not everyday Muslims nor should their actions tarnish the reputations of Muslims everywhere. You can't hold them or their religion accountable for that and if you really think all churches near military bases are disrespectful because of the actions of the Westboro Baptist Church then you're a fool. By that logic if someone was raped then ALL men should have a restraining order that they shouldn't be allowed to go near that victim. If someone was hit by a drunk driver than no one should be allowed to have a drink within miles of that person. If someone was robbed by a black person then ALL black people should be put on a restraining order to stay away from that person.

That is how idiotic your logic sounds and I'm done trying to talk to a person who thinks like that.