13 years old girl hangs herself

[Grandpa]

Sampling Quoted From the Above:

OH FFS, goddamn new idiot alert.

i lol at her death

Dude that's ..... up. If I ever came face to face with you...
Not something to joke about.

It doesn't matter how sad or pathetic their motives are, laughing at a suicide is just stupid... no suicide, under any circumstance (even if they aren't the most noble) should be laughed at.

i am going to beat my kid so much that he wont even think of becomeing emo

well at least the population would decrease by 1.

but seriously, those emo's who hang themselves should be shot..

the girl i loved hung herself :'(

PS. Death2Emos

no...emo is a label that people use divide themselves even further...
It's not a fad, it's not a lifestyle choice, it's not a genre of music, it's not an attitude, it's just a label. A meaningless overused label, nothing more.

omg my virgin eyes! i think i've read it all on srf after reading that.
Grandpa note: I've read worse, had worse said to me in x-ian chatrooms too. /yawn

LAME. Saying she threw her life away? Throw away all the EMOS!

Because at 13, she doesn't understand.

ABOUT those who post 'cold' responses:
I almost want to say that they've never had anybody close to them be raped or commit suicide.
Lacking understanding is different than being an "idiot". One out of three women will be raped at least once in their lifetime (1:3). Most likely people who say things like that are too young to know about or be told about life, but with statistics like that it won't be long.

Can we find this humorous? Some yes. I remember when my dad died. It was one of the most impactive events of my life. My family has a bizarre sense of humor (probably got it from my dad). If anybody saw us they would have been shocked. It was two days later while we watched some Monty Python and there was a scene where they had a casket that was moving itself to the grave. There were no pallbearers but the casket kinda schooched itself along. Like the dead guy inside was doing it, well, we saw this and started talking and laughing about our bald dad getting balder while he head-bumped his way along.

Not everybody reacts the same way is my point. I've read somewhere that most, if not all, humor or things we find funny can be traced to base elements of fear.

When my wife was raped the 'shrapnel' of her deep, unending ache struck me thunderously in the heart. It took me days to be even remotely sociable. I became sensitized to all sexual references (especially from TV) as 'part of the problem'. You know the attitudes of the most extreme against bots? Like that, only worse.

A co-worker (named Darrel) took her (I was told against her will, but it doesn't matter) to a motel and used a date-rape drug on her. I got her call and went to her after. If it impacted me that much, I can't imagine how she bore up under it. My friends told me that they would go with me to find the creep, that they would help me kill. I was a Christian then and somehow said, "Vengeance is MINE, saith the LORD", and turned it over to Him, but believe me, I was tempted. It isn't something I can get over either. I had no clue until it 'touched me', and it wasn't me - it was my loved one who was assaulted. I wasn't even touched and it still hurts me.

No, it's not about 'emo' or 'music' or 'it's the parents fault', it's about senseless violence. Rape, murder (self-inflicted or not) and violence don't cling to any specific group. It's getting worse and our only defense (it seems) is to numb ourselves against the horror. False bravado doesn't change it. Don't ask me what will. Find a place where it is quiet and ask yourself. Be still inside and ask. The answer from your inner person may surprise you. We know more than we think. Having said this, I take my leave from the thread.

Mr.Grandpa

I agree with the final quote, but understand the reason too. We have no choice, getting stirred up about it doesn't change it. I still hold God to his word about Darrel though. I want Him to hold that man in sin until Judgment Day. I understand that I might be required to forgive him but parts of me really like the God of the Old Testament. I have released it to the Vengeance of God and want it to stay that way.

Wow man, thats cold.

[Crumpets]

Wall

Next time you quote me. Don't take it out of context. Allright ?

[Verfo]

Wow, look at the difference..

1st one looks so better and cuter than the 2nd, iam now

[Grandpa]

Wall

Next time you quote me. Don't take it out of context. Allright ?

Nice use of irony. I lol'd.

Thought I'd retire from this topic but...

Surprisingly there is little difference between suicide rates for subcultures of female suicides in the US such as 'Emotive Hardcore" or "Goth" or "Punk" and the overall rate for females. Studies have been conducted for decades that attempt to link music (for example, "Country", "Rock", "Heavy Biker Music" and other genres) but there is no direct link established. Other studies have attempted to show a causal relationship in a more broad sense between mass media and the increased rates of violence.

My conclusion? I firmly believe that those who consider lists of 'causes' are unable to see the actual case. They are looking in a very systematic manner and unable to view the problem. Gathering information is all fine and good, but what is the actual cause?

According to the June 2008 issue of The Campus Observer:

Suicide is also among the top three causes of death among young people aged 15 to 35 years. The reasons for suicide range from relationship or family problems, to study stress, financial difficulties and marital problems.

According to a TODAY article on Sept. 1, psychiatrist Dr. Chia Boon Hock said that the suicide rates in Singapore remained relatively stable despite fluctuations. He also mentioned that the rates “are a good index of the amount of ‘suffering’ occurring in our society.”

My thoughts regarding this (and other) problems?
Happy Father's Day, friends.


No, I'm not blaming dads. Especially not today. But to me the 'cause' that prevents healthy kids from thriving while they are raised is primarily broken relationships especially those between fathers and children. The cause isn't found within the dads who have for instance said (in their best cave-man voice), "Me is Provider" (and not nurturer). "I am hunter, she is gatherer" isn't it. The causes aren't found within the children who have purposely walked along paths of disenfranchisement. The problem lies between the two, not within but between the 'hearts' of each. The need is for hearts to be turned back toward each other. It is only then that our world may be healed. That's just one man's opinion, but yeah.

Let me ask you though, how many have fathers or know friends whose fathers could be said to be vitally interested in them? Then what about the kids also? How many of your friends could you honestly say have a real and vital bond with their dads? Today is a good day to start to change the world. Mean it when you say it and maybe he'll notice (eventually).


~Grandpa

FOOTNOTES:
World Health Assembly. Prevention of violence: public health priority. Geneva, Switzerland: World Health Organization, 1996. (Resolution no. WHA49.25).
US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
The Campus Observer

[Qosta420]

this is so stupid. i highly doubt that girl commited suicide because she started listening to shitty emo music, she was probobly farked up in the head or severly depressed just like nearly everyone else who commits suicide.

[[SD]Master_Wong]

I am growing tired of the media's representation of music/game/tv & movies been the cause of any situation ranging from suicide to violence.

The reason behind people doing such things is because of the enviroment and upbringing they recieve, sure passing the blame onto something else is very much easy for a parent to do and it will always be expanded by the media. But before My Chemical Romance it was Marilyn Manson, for games it is Mass Effect, GTA.

Yes this is very sad but the reason behind this should be looked further into maybe something happened at home, with friends, at school or even troubles with a boy, but you cannot blame any 3rd party for anything of this kind it is merly passing the blame

[XCaosX]

dont wanna be bad\numb..but
how can people be so stupid to hurt themself till this?

[Grimjaw]

dont wanna be bad\numb..but
how can people be so stupid to hurt themself till this?

It takes some understanding.

Here,i will give you 1 example.

Why Do Teens Try to Kill Themselves?

Most teens interviewed after making a suicide attempt say that they did it because they were trying to escape from a situation that seemed impossible to deal with or to get relief from really bad thoughts or feelings. Like this girl, they didn’t want to die as much as they wanted to escape from what was going on. And at that particular moment dying seemed like the only way out.

Some people who end their lives or attempt suicide might be trying to escape feelings of rejection, hurt, or loss. Others might be angry, ashamed, or guilty about something. Some people may be worried about disappointing friends or family members. And some may feel unwanted, unloved, victimized, or like they’re a burden to others.

We all feel overwhelmed by difficult emotions or situations sometimes. But most people get through it or can put their problems in perspective and find a way to carry on with determination and hope. So why does one person try suicide when another person in the same tough situation does not? What makes some people more resilient (better able to deal with life’s setbacks and difficulties) than others? What makes a person unable to see another way out of a bad situation besides ending his or her life?

The answer to those questions lies in the fact that most people who commit suicide have depression.




Judging by that picture on the left, she probably would have a wonderfull smile.

To bad the world will never see it anymore.

[boast]

guess Lithuanians are the worst parents ever

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate

[Nuklear]

I am growing tired of the media's representation of music/game/tv & movies been the cause of any situation ranging from suicide to violence.

The reason behind people doing such things is because of the enviroment and upbringing they recieve, sure passing the blame onto something else is very much easy for a parent to do and it will always be expanded by the media. But before My Chemical Romance it was Marilyn Manson, for games it is Mass Effect, GTA.

Yes this is very sad but the reason behind this should be looked further into maybe something happened at home, with friends, at school or even troubles with a boy, but you cannot blame any 3rd party for anything of this kind it is merly passing the blame

qfft

[Barotix]

guess Lithuanians are the worst parents ever

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate

HeHe, is nature VS nurture time nao?
OnT: very sad, but still pointless.

[Love]

i wouldnt mind if half the world went suicidal right now, more stuff for the non stupid ones

[IceCrash]

i wouldnt mind if half the world went suicidal right now, more stuff for the non stupid ones

that's a very bad way of thinking in my opinion.. have you thought that, every kind of person has his role in this world? We all would die, cause then there wouldnt be people that'd want to do certain jobs..
Everything's equilibrated, in it's own way..

anyways, i wont talk more lol

[Qosta420]

i wouldnt mind if half the world went suicidal right now, more stuff for the non stupid ones

who decides whos stupid or not? maybe youd be one of the ones whod kill themselves.

[rek]

blahh

Off topic: Luls your still using the bar i made. Old.

[Verfo]

based on this i blame her parents and her country,i will start with both at the same time, if you go to that website where it shows you the suicide rate and go to Egypt you will see it has 0.00 for total why? because the parents teach their children well and dont let them go emo and crap, (if you go to Egypt I 100% guarantee you that you wont find 1 emo or 1 goth at all), why is that? because in Egypt when we do something bad that our parent dislike we get our ass kicked, of course you might say beating your kids dont solve anything but no it does solve things, i remember when i was 10 years old and my parents told me that i had to come home at 10:00 and i came home at 12:00 that night, i got my ass kicked so hard i wont forget it for the rest of my life, since that day i do the stuff they tell me. Iam not saying that you should go home right now and beat up your kids, iam saying that you have to have control over them, i see people everyday on cops calling the police on their parents WTF???

ps: sry for spelling mistakes and i dont want to hear any flaming .

[MrFudge]

based on this i blame her parents and her country,i will start with both at the same time, if you go to that website where it shows you the suicide rate and go to Egypt you will see it has 0.00 for total why? because the parents teach their children well and dont let them go emo and crap, (if you go to Egypt I 100% guarantee you that you wont find 1 emo or 1 goth at all), why is that? because in Egypt when we do something bad that our parent dislike we get our ass kicked, of course you might say beating your kids dont solve anything but no it does solve things, i remember when i was 10 years old and my parents told me that i had to come home at 10:00 and i came home at 12:00 that night, i got my ass kicked so hard i wont forget it for the rest of my life, since that day i do the stuff they tell me. Iam not saying that you should go home right now and beat up your kids, iam saying that you have to have control over them, i see people everyday on cops calling the police on their parents WTF???

ps: sry for spelling mistakes and i dont want to hear any flaming .

thats true, every eyptian ive ever met has been really well mannered.
even the wanna-be ghetto ones are polite but still dress like 50 cent and lil wayne.

btw, was she also a jew? if so...cha-ching!! $$$$moneys
jk jk jk lol.

[Verfo]

if you judge egyptians based on isro then i dislike them myself, and i never said they r mannered i said they control there kids

[Grandpa]

I'm not convinced.

When I first heard about kids killing other kids in school (Columbine) back in 1999 there was a lot of speculation about it being the parents fault. "They should have taught their kids better than that!" "They didn't teach their children right from wrong!"

So I took action. I called my kids to me and instructed them:

"Boys! If you are ever at school and want to kill your friends, don't do it.
That's wrong."

A good friend of mine (Wayne) had a mother who was an alcoholic. His father was getting on in age and worried about what could happen with his kids if he passed away. He was very controlling and Wayne couldn't hardly do anything. What happened to Wayne? Last I heard he was still heavily addicted to a combination of illegal drugs. It started out 'innocent' enough as rebellion, perhaps justified.

One of the problems regarding "suicide rates" as reported by different countries is that there are no standards of reporting. I'm not trying to say anything about various countries or races but there is no level playing field to draw conclusions from. To me, strict control of children is a two-edged sword. Raising children isn't a matter of finding a bigger stick but total neglect is worse. For instance, a 'christian' friend of mine used a paddle to spank his kids. He was a good friend and could quote the bible to justify the abuse. I let him know (in no uncertain terms) that he should NEVER let me see this happen. I had no 'evidence' other than his admission but would have called the police in a heartbeat if I ever saw him beating a kid. Those kids? Last I heard they turned out normal enough (luckily).

Over the last several decades, the suicide rate in young people has increased dramatically. In 1997, suicide was the 3rd leading cause of death in 15 to 24 year olds - 11.5 of every 100,000 persons - following unintentional injuries and homicide. Untreated depression is the number one factor or 'cause' of suicide among youth.

Courtesy of CalTech:

Symptoms of Depression

• Sleep - Excessive sleep or difficulties falling and staying asleep, nightmares.
  
• Interest - Loss of interest in pleasurable activities such as work, recreation, hobbies, food, sex.
  
• Guilt - Feelings of guilt that are excessive for the situation, or a constant feeling of worthlessness.
  
• Energy - Loss of energy, fatigue, decreased motivation, difficulty initiating tasks.
  
• Concentration - Difficulty concentrating, focusing, or remembering.
  
• Appetite - Increased or decreased appetite possibly resulting in weight gain or loss.
  
• Mood - Appears down, has a pessimistic or cynical attitude, or is generally apathetic.
  
• Suicidal Ideation - Suicidal thoughts or intentions.
  
• Social Withdrawal - Isolation, change in desire to engage with others. May stay in their room more than usual.
  
• Avoidance Behavior - Spending increased and excessive time engaging in behavior to distract themselves (computer games, surfing the net) or behaviors that are self-destructive (alcohol, drug use, or cutting). Avoids people to whom they feel an obligation to do something but are unable to (advisors, professors, TA's etc.)
  
• Appearance - People who are depressed sometimes have less interest in their appearance or have less energy to invest in grooming. They may shower less frequently, or wear the same or wrinkled clothes repeatedly.

If you or one of your friends are depressed or suspected of being suicidal BE BOLD.

I don't think these types of things are caused by music or parents or any other single thing.
It is part of the world we live in.
My best answer includes both parents and kids.

I'm reminded of a scene from Pretty Woman:

Vivian: [sitting with Edward leaning against her in the bathtub] Did I mention, my leg is 44" from hip to toe. So basically we are talking about 88" of therapy, wrapped around you for the bargain price of $3000 dollars.

Edward had just explained that he paid $3000 to his therapist to be able to say, "I am angry with my father."

~Grandpa

[Love]

based on this i blame her parents and her country,i will start with both at the same time, if you go to that website where it shows you the suicide rate and go to Egypt you will see it has 0.00 for total why? because the parents teach their children well and dont let them go emo and crap, (if you go to Egypt I 100% guarantee you that you wont find 1 emo or 1 goth at all), why is that? because in Egypt when we do something bad that our parent dislike we get our ass kicked, of course you might say beating your kids dont solve anything but no it does solve things, i remember when i was 10 years old and my parents told me that i had to come home at 10:00 and i came home at 12:00 that night, i got my ass kicked so hard i wont forget it for the rest of my life, since that day i do the stuff they tell me. Iam not saying that you should go home right now and beat up your kids, iam saying that you have to have control over them, i see people everyday on cops calling the police on their parents WTF???

ps: sry for spelling mistakes and i dont want to hear any flaming .

blaming country, just so Farking stupid the only ones to blame here are the parents and newsflash beating up your kids isnt good parenting, it means you lack the brain to educate them properly

[Verfo]

then please explain to me why i see gunners in the news everyday and not on any other country?

[MrFudge]

then please explain to me why i see gunners in the news everyday and not on any other country?

the news is different everywhere.
take american (USA) news for instance, they brainwash americans in so many ways.

[Inuyasha584]

Sampling Quoted From the Above:

OH FFS, goddamn new idiot alert.

i lol at her death

Dude that's ..... up. If I ever came face to face with you...
Not something to joke about.

It doesn't matter how sad or pathetic their motives are, laughing at a suicide is just stupid... no suicide, under any circumstance (even if they aren't the most noble) should be laughed at.

i am going to beat my kid so much that he wont even think of becomeing emo

well at least the population would decrease by 1.

but seriously, those emo's who hang themselves should be shot..

the girl i loved hung herself :'(

PS. Death2Emos

no...emo is a label that people use divide themselves even further...
It's not a fad, it's not a lifestyle choice, it's not a genre of music, it's not an attitude, it's just a label. A meaningless overused label, nothing more.

omg my virgin eyes! i think i've read it all on srf after reading that.
Grandpa note: I've read worse, had worse said to me in x-ian chatrooms too. /yawn

LAME. Saying she threw her life away? Throw away all the EMOS!

Because at 13, she doesn't understand.

ABOUT those who post 'cold' responses:
I almost want to say that they've never had anybody close to them be raped or commit suicide.
Lacking understanding is different than being an "idiot". One out of three women will be raped at least once in their lifetime (1:3). Most likely people who say things like that are too young to know about or be told about life, but with statistics like that it won't be long.

Can we find this humorous? Some yes. I remember when my dad died. It was one of the most impactive events of my life. My family has a bizarre sense of humor (probably got it from my dad). If anybody saw us they would have been shocked. It was two days later while we watched some Monty Python and there was a scene where they had a casket that was moving itself to the grave. There were no pallbearers but the casket kinda schooched itself along. Like the dead guy inside was doing it, well, we saw this and started talking and laughing about our bald dad getting balder while he head-bumped his way along.

Not everybody reacts the same way is my point. I've read somewhere that most, if not all, humor or things we find funny can be traced to base elements of fear.

When my wife was raped the 'shrapnel' of her deep, unending ache struck me thunderously in the heart. It took me days to be even remotely sociable. I became sensitized to all sexual references (especially from TV) as 'part of the problem'. You know the attitudes of the most extreme against bots? Like that, only worse.

A co-worker (named Darrel) took her (I was told against her will, but it doesn't matter) to a motel and used a date-rape drug on her. I got her call and went to her after. If it impacted me that much, I can't imagine how she bore up under it. My friends told me that they would go with me to find the creep, that they would help me kill. I was a Christian then and somehow said, "Vengeance is MINE, saith the LORD", and turned it over to Him, but believe me, I was tempted. It isn't something I can get over either. I had no clue until it 'touched me', and it wasn't me - it was my loved one who was assaulted. I wasn't even touched and it still hurts me.

No, it's not about 'emo' or 'music' or 'it's the parents fault', it's about senseless violence. Rape, murder (self-inflicted or not) and violence don't cling to any specific group. It's getting worse and our only defense (it seems) is to numb ourselves against the horror. False bravado doesn't change it. Don't ask me what will. Find a place where it is quiet and ask yourself. Be still inside and ask. The answer from your inner person may surprise you. We know more than we think. Having said this, I take my leave from the thread.

Mr.Grandpa

I agree with the final quote, but understand the reason too. We have no choice, getting stirred up about it doesn't change it. I still hold God to his word about Darrel though. I want Him to hold that man in sin until Judgment Day. I understand that I might be required to forgive him but parts of me really like the God of the Old Testament. I have released it to the Vengeance of God and want it to stay that way.

Wow man, thats cold.

oh i feel bad for your wife

[boast]

blaming country, just so Farking stupid the only ones to blame here are the parents and newsflash beating up your kids isnt good parenting, it means you lack the brain to educate them properly

"Japan has one of the highest suicide rates among rich countries. Cultural factors are partly at play. Japanese society rarely lets people bounce back from the perceived shame of failure or bankruptcy. Suicide is sometimes even met with approval—as facing one's fate, not shirking it."

[SM-Count]

I am growing tired of the media's representation of music/game/tv & movies been the cause of any situation ranging from suicide to violence.

The reason behind people doing such things is because of the enviroment and upbringing they recieve, sure passing the blame onto something else is very much easy for a parent to do and it will always be expanded by the media. But before My Chemical Romance it was Marilyn Manson, for games it is Mass Effect, GTA.

Yes this is very sad but the reason behind this should be looked further into maybe something happened at home, with friends, at school or even troubles with a boy, but you cannot blame any 3rd party for anything of this kind it is merly passing the blame

qfft

Media or "media"?

The quality at which this article was written in hints that it belongs with the latter. Most reliable media sources will have psychologists and forensic experts in the story to cite the real state of mind she was in when she died and analyze the diary, and her behavior further than a laundry list of pictures in it with random bits of cut off phrases. I agree that it's dam irresponsible to make inferences for yourself by putting 2 and 2 together to make 7 and present it to the public when all you have is a journalism degree, if even that, and what looks like 3/4th of a page of research; most of which must've been song lyrics.

This is why I don't read bullshit publications or like Jack Thompson.

[Silver0]

Nvm
funny part is i can blame religion again

[ShizKnight]

You guys are trying to place the blame on her parents, the music, or nobody at all. In truth, its probably the combined stress from life, her relationship with her parents, the music, and everything else that takes her to the brink of sanity. Who knows? She could have had a traumatic childhood to boot.

Rather than being strong enough to face her problems head on, she was drawn in by the allure of suicide. In other words, life is tough, none of us know the exact reason why she killed herself, and speculation is stupid.

[Teddybeer]

the farking music should be forbidden...
Emo's are too obsessed by the darkness that they make themself...
they jus WANT to be pessimist..

[Judge]

You guys are trying to place the blame on her parents, the music, or nobody at all. In truth, its probably the combined stress from life, her relationship with her parents, the music, and everything else that takes her to the brink of sanity. Who knows? She could have had a traumatic childhood to boot.

Rather than being strong enough to face her problems head on, she was drawn in by the allure of suicide. In other words, life is tough, none of us know the exact reason why she killed herself, and speculation is stupid.

You sir are the only one to hit the nail on the dime, for that I salute you. There is no one action, inaction, person, place, or art to blame. It is a mix, a hash, a combination. It was it all, the attraction, that fantasy. The obsession. Death, a tragic yet beautiful episode. She wanted it, either as an escape or to fulfill a dream, a want, a drive, a void. There is not one single universal cause and no one person, place, or thing is to blame. Let us leave it at that.

[Grandpa]

Quoting Judge from above (speaking in reply to another post)

You sir are the only one to hit the nail on the dime, for that I salute you. There is no one action, inaction, person, place, or art to blame. It is a mix, a hash, a combination. It was it all, the attraction, that fantasy. The obsession. Death, a tragic yet beautiful episode. She wanted it, either as an escape or to fulfill a dream, a want, a drive, a void. There is not one single universal cause and no one person, place, or thing is to blame. Let us leave it at that.

Mr.Judge,

I have enjoyed reading your posts. You command quite a bit of respect (and I don't often say this). I agree with what you are saying about 'cause'. The thread opened with a link to a superficial journalist who apparently wanted to increase circulation by grabbing a headline. The fact that it has been discussed to such extent here (as well as other forums and media) points toward the journalists well chosen strategy.

Still, and more toward what you were saying ("there is not one single universal cause and no one person, place, or thing is to blame. Let us leave it at that")... [emphasis mine]

Would it be fair for me to think that you are advocating doing nothing about the increasing tragedy we see in society? From what I know of you by reading your posts I can't believe it would be fair of me to so do. Let it not be so.

~Granps